The Jack News: ‘If Elected, Roy Moore Could Ditch the GOP for the Constitution Party’

The Jack News (excerpt):

In the aftermath of a series of allegations that Republican Alabama Senate candidate Roy Moore molested and assaulted teenage girls, the Republican National Committee, as well as the National Republican Senatorial Committee, have cut ties to Moore.

If elected, several senior GOP senators including Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, have predicted his expulsion.

The Constitution Party in standing by Roy Moore, and is endorsing and fundraising for him

The party’s platform, among other things, calls for the recriminalization of pornography and homosexuality. They are militant in their opposition to abortion, same-sex marriage, and the separation of church and state. Even the presence of non-Christians in the party has caused controversy, which has in turn lead to disputed accusations of anti-semitism.

Moore is not new to the Constitution Party, either. In 2004, shortly after being removed – for the first time – from his state supreme court position, Moore heavily considered a run for president as the party’s nominee. He ultimately decided against that, instead running unsuccessfully for governor in the 2006 GOP primary.

Despite turning down its offer to run for president, Moore has maintained a close informal association with the Constitution Party. He went on a speaking tour campaigning for their 2004 nominee, Michael Peroutka. As recently as earlier this year, he spoke to the party’s national meeting, which was held in Huntsville.

Which raises an interesting question: If elected on December 12, might Moore officially switch to the Constitution Party?

Moore will owe nothing to the Republican Party, which has eagerly been trying to push him aside and even threatening to expel him.

Such a move would revive the sagging fortunes of this far-right micro-party, and probably result in more attention than they have ever before received or merited.

Read full article

66 thoughts on “The Jack News: ‘If Elected, Roy Moore Could Ditch the GOP for the Constitution Party’

  1. Pingback: Another Write-in Candidate Enters Alabama Senate Race, Gathers Mainstream Coverage | Independent Political Report

  2. paulie Post author

    GOOD Idea, let’s get the paleos to join him!

    The sooner the better, particularly ones who still litter the LP with their presence.

  3. William Saturn

    It will be beneficial to have another noninterventionist in the Senate (alongside Rand Paul). I suspect the military-industrial complex is partially behind the efforts to derail Moore.

  4. Andy

    “William Saturn
    November 29, 2017 at 01:55
    It will be beneficial to have another noninterventionist in the Senate (alongside Rand Paul). I suspect the military-industrial complex is partially behind the efforts to derail Moore.”

    How sure are you that Roy Moore really supports a non-interventionist foreign policy? Can you show some evidence to support this?

  5. Luke

    It’s news to me if true. I’ve watched his TV ads and campaign speeches and never heard him speak against any wars or deployments or military spending. He’s a big fan of Putin though. Probably Duterte and Erdogan too but I only heard him praise Putin. If he ever made an issue of foreign policy I haven’t seen it . For that matter I haven’t seen Doug Jones make much of foreign policy either. Is he a big war hawk? I haven’t seen him talk about it but maybe he just keeps it on the back burner. Then again William Saturn probably still thinks Trump is a non-interventionist too. LOL

  6. Luke

    “military-industrial complex is partially behind the efforts to derail Moore.”

    Yep, with their secret human cloning and time travel technology they sent a Moore clone back in time to molest teenage girls in the 1970s and 80s.

  7. Luke

    Sounds like cheap throwaway rhetoric which he never emphasizes in his campaign. And his support for Peroutka most likely had a lot more to do with both of their extreme social reactionary and theocratic as well as neo-confederate views than any foreign policy questions. I do know Moore has contempt for Muslims and Latinos and a protectionist trade policy position so that’s not a good sign for where he will really come down on real world conflicts that the US is likely to become embroiled in the next few years.

  8. Andy

    “Luke
    November 29, 2017 at 02:54
    Sounds like cheap throwaway rhetoric which he never emphasizes in his campaign. And his support for Peroutka most likely had a lot more to do with both of their extreme social reactionary and theocratic as well as neo-confederate views than any foreign policy questions. I do know Moore has contempt for Muslims and Latinos and a protectionist trade policy position so that’s not a good sign for where he will really come down on real world conflicts that the US is likely to become embroiled in the next few years.”

    None of this proves that Roy Moore supports an interventionist foreign policy, but neither does what William Saturn posted prove that he does not (a person can lie). I suppose that we will find out if he wins the election.

    If I were an Alabama voter, I would either write in the Libertarian guy (Ron Bishop) or not bother voting in this election.

  9. Cody Quirk

    “He’d be the perfect member for the American Taliban party.”

    Yes he would.
    HOWEVER if he actually joined the CP, I highly doubt that he would reverse the declining fortunes of the CP; in fact him joining could do the opposite; a Roy Moore presence in the CP would only bring more hardcore religious zealots and extremists into the CP’s ranks and give a very hard time to the LDS leaders and active members in the CP like they did in the early 2000s -therefore bringing about strife and denominational sectarianism in the CP’s ranks.

    Furthermore, unless Roy Moore would be willing to dedicate his time to helping the CP regain ballot access and organizing new state parties -his presence would only be a temporary boost for the CP in terms of publicity. Roy Moore is no right-wing populist; his appeal is strictly limited to fundamentalists and conservative voters of the Bible Belt, including social conservatives that do not think the GOP goes far enough on such issues.

  10. Thomas Knapp

    “Sounds like cheap throwaway rhetoric which he never emphasizes in his campaign.”

    Ron Paul’s initial emphasis in his first run for president (in his first fundraising letter) was on his yeoman’s service as a congresscritter in:

    1) Keeping the furriners from getting across the Rio Grande;
    2) Keeping the gays from getting married; and
    3) Keeping the wimmin from getting abortions.

    If you didn’t know who Paul was already, you’d have had no reason whatsoever to believe that he had any interest in foreign policy at all. It wasn’t until the debates that he made a splash with foreign policy as an issue.

    Which is not to say that Moore really is an interventionist. The fact that he doesn’t promote his past as a West Point graduate and army officer as a campaign credential makes me think he MIGHT be a quiet non-interventionist — or that he just doesn’t want to talk about foreign policy so as not to have to take a side.

  11. Luke

    “The fact that he doesn’t promote his past as a West Point graduate and army officer as a campaign credential …”

    Is that in fact a fact? Let’s find out.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GlMaP1vqQU

    Literally the first two things about him in this official campaign ad is that he is a West Point grad and Vietnam vet. That’s not atypical, and doesn’t by itself mean he is an interventionist, but it doesn’t mean he is a non-interventionist either.

    “HOWEVER if he actually joined the CP, I highly doubt that he would reverse the declining fortunes of the CP”

    If he became a sitting CP US Senator I think they would get a lot more attention than they do now. Too socially reactionary for the Republicans may not be a plurality position among the public at large but it’s much bigger than the active membership or even voter base of any existing third party.

    “None of this proves that Roy Moore supports an interventionist foreign policy,”

    No, it doesn’t, but

    1. “When goods don’t cross borders armies will” and Moore is a protectionist

    2. If he hasn’t bought in to the whole “clash of civilizations” between Christendom and the Muslim world he is at the very least a soft target for it

    3. Will building a massive border wall and rounding up and deporting millions of people lead to some kind of military conflict with Latin America? It could happen.

  12. Anon-Tipper

    Luke: “If he became a sitting CP US Senator I think they would get a lot more attention than they do now. Too socially reactionary for the Republicans may not be a plurality position among the public at large but it’s much bigger than the active membership or even voter base of any existing third party.”

    I wonder if the Republicans might encourage him to leave, in hopes that it will draw away some of their right-wing populists and Trump supporters.

  13. paulie Post author

    There’s certainly some Republicans who will want him to go away. But I think they will end up working with him just like they ended up working with Trump, because they want the votes of the Moore and Trump supporters to beat the Democrats. And unlike Luke I do believe Moore will be elected, so I believe we will see how this plays out in the real world.

  14. Thane Eichenauer

    Luke,
    The government of Mexico is funded by the US government. They will never revolt against it.

    As for Moore there are two indications that Moore does not seek to perpetuate wars.
    1) His quoted URL above.
    2) The powers that be are doing everything they can to elect “Anybody But Moore”.

    There is no more powerful lobby than the war lobby (well maybe the banker lobby). If the powers that be hate Roy Moore you can bet there is a reason why.

  15. Luke

    “The government of Mexico is funded by the US government. They will never revolt against it.”

    There are a lot of countries in Latin America, and many of them have been voted out of office, overthrown militarily or both at various times. What would make you think it wouldn’t happen again? For that matter it would hardly be the first time US troops would be deployed down there. It’s a volatile situation.

    “As for Moore there are two indications that Moore does not seek to perpetuate wars.
    1) His quoted URL above.”

    Meh. Throwaway website boilerplate. Written by junior staffers on most campaigns.

    “2) The powers that be are doing everything they can to elect “Anybody But Moore”.

    There is no more powerful lobby than the war lobby (well maybe the banker lobby). If the powers that be hate Roy Moore you can bet there is a reason why.”

    What Moore is rebelling against isn’t the establishment, it’s the enlightenment. His twisted world view is a nightmarish combination of the worst parts of the antebellum South, the dark ages between the fall of ancient Rome and the relative revival of the middle ages, and the Old Testament patriarchs. The bankster-welfare-warfare state establishment is twisted as well, but relatively sane by comparison, and that’s saying a lot.

    Rest assured that Moore would have his own bankster, welfare and warfare replacements, just with more nativism, protectionism, know-nothingism, xenophobia, and most of all extremely socially reactionary policies. Don’t be too surprised if he goes for Clash of Civilizations with the Muslim World, China/East Asia, and Latin America, making the militarism of the establishment seem small time by comparison.

  16. Anon-Tipper

    paulie: “There’s certainly some Republicans who will want him to go away. But I think they will end up working with him just like they ended up working with Trump, because they want the votes of the Moore and Trump supporters to beat the Democrats. And unlike Luke I do believe Moore will be elected, so I believe we will see how this plays out in the real world.”

    I guess I shouldn’t expect much from them. It’s just a team sport.

  17. paulie Post author

    Sad but true. Moore is tracking up. He will win, and he won’t be expelled. They need his vote, so who gives a shit if he molested teenagers and got kicked off the bench twice and thinks the Bible is the law of the land and believes freedom of religion is only for Christians and that Muslims or women should not be allowed to run for office…among many other things. They need his vote to beat the Democrats and that is literally the only thing that matters. If David Duke won a primary now, as opposed to back in the 1990s, they would make the same excuses for him. It may yet happen.

  18. Thane Eichenauer

    Luke comments, “The bankster-welfare-warfare state establishment is twisted as well, but relatively sane by comparison, and that’s saying a lot.”

    Roy Moore is one man (if elected) whose direct power would amount to little more than marking yes or no on pieces of paper called bills. If he is less sane than the people that actively support war abroad then I fail to understand your reasoning.

    “We should not be entangled in foreign wars merely at the whim and caprice of a President.”

    As far as his website position on war being boilerplate perhaps you can point out two examples of similar wording being used by other political candidates. I have followed many political campaigns online. That wording seems unique-ish to me. Perhaps my 50 year old brain cells are failing me and he took those words from some Libertarian candidate that I overlooked.

  19. Thane Eichenauer

    Luke> Don’t be too surprised if he goes for Clash of Civilizations with the Muslim World, China/East Asia, and Latin America, making the militarism of the establishment seem small time by comparison.

    If Donald Freaking Trump isn’t willing to do more than invoke hocus pocus sanctions on the rulers of Venezuela I hardly think that Roy Moore is likely to instigate anything useful relative to Latin America.

    As far as a Moore instigated Clash of Civilizations with the Muslim World goes the US government is already years deep into a Clash of Civilizations with the some of the Muslim World and is doing a bang up (and blow up) job if you work for or are invested in US “defence” industry stocks AKA the Dow Jones of the Powers That Be and their downstream sycophants. Why ever would the Powers That Be oppose someone that wants to speed up the death from above production line? Why Luke why?

  20. Luke

    “Roy Moore is one man (if elected) whose direct power would amount to little more than marking yes or no on pieces of paper called bills.”

    Fair point, but if so, supposing he is as antiwar as you claim, why would the “powers that be” be so concerned about him? It’s not like he has the power to veto their wars all by themselves. Besides, Drumpf touts his opposition to Jones as being among the chief reasons for which “weak on the military.” Doesn’t that imply that Moore is “stronger” on military spending and flexing? Moore hasn’t seen fit to correct the president on this either.

    “If he is less sane than the people that actively support war abroad then I fail to understand your reasoning.”

    There are a number of terms for it such as jumping from the frying pan into the fire or going from bad to worse.

    ” That wording seems unique-ish to me. Perhaps my 50 year old brain cells are failing me and he took those words from some Libertarian candidate that I overlooked.”

    Maybe a junior staffer is a Constitution Party type of all-around isolationist. What I said isn’t uncommon is for junior staffers to write website boilerplate; content is a separate matter.

  21. Luke

    “all by themselves. ”

    All by himself. I try not to engage in Andyesque “should read” but in that case the meaning could have been lost.

    “If Donald Freaking Trump isn’t willing to do more than invoke hocus pocus sanctions on the rulers of Venezuela I hardly think that Roy Moore is likely to instigate anything useful relative to Latin America.”

    We’re less than a year into the Donald Trump Freaking presidency. What makes you think that’s all he’s willing to do? The circumstances have yet to present themselves but they very well might. Already Trump is pushing us to the brink of war in Korea and intensifying US participation in conflicts all over the Middle East and North Africa.

    “As far as a Moore instigated Clash of Civilizations with the Muslim World goes the US government is already years deep into a Clash of Civilizations with the some of the Muslim World”

    That’s only a few individual skirmishes, with both allies and enemies in the Muslim World. Quite different from being at war with 1.5 to 2 billion Muslims who form the ruling majority in dozens of countries and a substantial minority in many of the others.

    “Why ever would the Powers That Be oppose someone that wants to speed up the death from above production line? Why Luke why?”

    Because a child molester who gets thrown off the bench twice, thinks the Bible is the law of the land, etc, etc, is too nuts even for them. Believe it or not they have *some* standards. Maybe they just aren’t ready for a serious national conversation about reviving the antebellum South, the Dark Ages of Europe or the Old Testament patriarchy on the floor of the Senate. Maybe they think he will cause more of their candidates around the country to lose next year, or that he’ll become too much of a distraction.

    The “powers that be” came down pretty hard on David Duke when he ran for statewide office in Louisiana as a major party candidate too. Could there have been some other reason for it besides his positions on military spending?

  22. Tony From Long Island

    Thane: ” . . . . .The government of Mexico is funded by the US government. . . . .”

    And you base this on?

  23. paulie Post author

    Luke said on another thread that he is betting $69.14 on Moore to lose. I think I’ll go ahead and bet the same amount on Moore to win.

  24. paulie Post author

    I’ve heard no allegation that is exactly what he did. Maybe it’s symbolic and allegorical, or maybe that’s just what Luke had available when he placed the bet.

  25. Tony From Long Island

    that should be NOT really all that comfortable!! grrr brain moves faster than fingers.

  26. Luke

    69 works best when you got a pigtailed spinner and you can hold her up easily while you’re standing. Or so my buddy Roy Loess tells me. No relation to Roy Moore, they were just born in the same hospital on the same day, look a lot alike and have the same first name. Roy Loess was a dental assistant back before he retired and was known for his duck’s ass haircut. He has a Doctor of Arts he never did anything with, and the twelve step program’s code of silence prevents me from disclosing whether he was ever a member of Debtors Anonymous. Sometimes Roy Loess used to pretend to be Roy Moore to pick up young girls.

  27. Anon-Tipper

    Paulie: “…They need his vote to beat the Democrats and that is literally the only thing that matters. If David Duke won a primary now, as opposed to back in the 1990s, they would make the same excuses for him. It may yet happen.”

    The GOP needs to just split (after ending FPTP), it’s a Frankenstein united in hating Democrats. They pretty much lost moderate conservatives and new england republicans who are just staying independent now.

  28. wolfefan

    The GOP doesn’t need Moore to actually be in the Senate. They just need him to win the election. Then they can vote not to seat him and the Governor can appoint another Republican in his place.

  29. Thane Eichenauer

    Luke,
    I think that Mitch McConnell and the establishment Republicans are in league with the establishment Democrats to continue the spending campaign and the bombing and invading and occupation campaigns. I scoff at the idea that McConnell has any personal moral standards other than the spending MUST continue, the bombing MUST continue and the deployment of US troops abroad MUST continue.
    I could agree with you that neither Chuck Schumer, nor Nancy Pelosi, not Mitch McConnell want any national conversation on biblical patriarchy or government funding of Planned Parenthood.
    I choose to defer discussing David Duke until he is an announced candidate.

    My premise is that it is all about the spending. It seems like the simplest answer to me.

  30. Thane Eichenauer

    This pointer to a very amusing bit of political satire aimed Alabama way goes out in the name of Luke.

    “Hello, fellow Republicans. As you all know, there’s been a lot in the news recently about a certain Senate candidate.

    The Libs may try to shame you into voting for their party over ours, but do NOT let them. I am here to tell you that you are still perfectly within your right to vote for Gormöth the Destroyer.” MOORE AT THE LINK BELOW (pun intended)

    http://mashable.com/2017/11/30/gormoth-the-destroyer-senate.amp

    Thanks to Comfortably Smug for the pointer.
    https://twitter.com/ComfortablySmug/status/936447552022630400

  31. Thane Eichenauer

    http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/11/30/cop-accuser-breitbart-interview-unsupported-claims-moore/

    “Speaking to Breitbart News, Gary claimed that she was not motivated by anger over Moore’s involvement in convicting her brother.”

    They refers to Faye Gary. The article also offers additional critique of the cheerleader protection claim.

    On PreditIt shares of Moore will loose are down to 23 cents down from 28 cents last time I quoted it. It doesn’t look good for either Doug Jones or Luke’s bet.

    https://www.predictit.org/Contract/6640/Will-Roy-Moore-win-the-2017-US-Senate-special-election-in-Alabama#data

    On the shiny side Ron Bishop did tweet yesterday. +1 for bold use of color.
    https://twitter.com/RonBishopLP/status/936221882793250816

  32. Tony From Long Island

    Thane: ” . . . .https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mérida_Initiative#Funding

    My claim might be a bit weak on a percentage of total budget basis but funding is funding. . . . .

    Thane, your link shows that the US approves $400 million over three years to Mexico. So you are telling me that the entire Mexican government is fun on $133 million a year? C’mon man! The U.S. isn’t “funding” the Mexican government. We give dozens of nations money (not that I agree with that).

  33. paulie Post author

    $400 million over three years to the Mexican regime? Well that will certainly prevent any wars in Latin America that the US regime may get involved in over the next decade or two or three, for sure.

  34. paulie Post author

    Speaking to Breitbart News,

    Never a good idea. Complete Putinist propaganda outfit.

    Gary claimed that she was not motivated by anger over Moore’s involvement in convicting her brother.

    Of course not, when she is just confirming what dozens of other people have said.

    On PreditIt shares of Moore will loose are down to 23 cents down from 28 cents last time I quoted it. It doesn’t look good for either Doug Jones or Luke’s bet.

    Well, you got one thing right.

  35. paulie Post author

    I choose to defer discussing David Duke until he is an announced candidate.

    My premise is that it is all about the spending. It seems like the simplest answer to me.

    Duke WAS a candidate, for Governor and Senator, in the 1990s. Like Moore, he had already held office in his state, in Duke’s case as a legislator. Like Moore, he won Republican statewide primaries for major office. And exactly like Moore, and for very similar reasons, Duke was opposed by the establishment leadership of both of the largest parties and the mainstream news commenters. In Duke’s case it was because he is a racial bigot who had very publicly paraded around in nazi and KKK outfits, denied the holocaust, etc. In Moore’s case it is because he is a religious bigot who has defied the rule of law and been kicked off the bench repeatedly, believes the Bible is literally the law of the land, does not believe the First Amendment applies to non-Christian religions, does not believe in equality before the law and stands very credibly accused of child molestation.

    Given those facts it is inane and ridiculous to fantasize that the opposition to Moore is for any other reason than the opposition to Duke, or that this reason has anything to do with spending, particularly on the military. It’s even more inane and ridiculous when you see that one of the main reasons the Cheeto Benito gives for voting for Moore is that Jones is “weak on the military,” and rather than correct the president on this point Moore touts his support.

  36. paulie Post author

    The GOP doesn’t need Moore to actually be in the Senate. They just need him to win the election. Then they can vote not to seat him and the Governor can appoint another Republican in his place.

    It’s highly unlikely, and many doubt legal, that they would vote to not seat someone who was elected by the voters of their state. They may be able to expel, but that is also of dubious legality when the behavior in question was long before admission to the Senate, is past the legal statute of limitations and was known to the voters. Experts disagree whether such an expulsion would hold up legally. Even if it would, it’s even less likely that it will be politically feasible or desirable by the very same Republicans who desperately need every vote they can get in the Senate and don’t have many scruples about how they get one.

  37. paulie Post author

    This pointer to a very amusing bit of political satire aimed Alabama way

    It would be amusing if it wasn’t all too true.

  38. Thane Eichenauer

    paulie> Never a good idea. Complete Putinist propaganda outfit.

    Breitbart claims to have interviewed Faye Gary. 50% or more of the article is direct quotes from her. Her quotes are her quotes. Her brother was prosecuted by Roy Moore. He was the attorney in the court room. Some facts are facts no matter how many pictures of Vladimir Putin you imagine there are in the offices of Breitbart. I’ll bet Breitbart could produce audio and video of the interview if needed which is something that Moore’s accusers cannot.

    Roy Moore is alleged to have tweeted at Jimmy Kimmel, “Despite D.C. and Hollywood Elites’ bigotry towards southerners, Jimmy, we’ll save you a seat on the front pew,”
    http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2017/11/roy_moore_tweet_to_jimmy_kimme.html

    Since Kimmel’s reply implies that he is deathly afraid of attending church services how about you take up the invitation on his behalf? I’ll bet that Moore would even treat you to brunch afterwards. I’d also bet that Doug Jones would be willing to cover transportation costs.

  39. paulie Post author

    Her brother was prosecuted by Roy Moore.

    So what? Maybe it explains why she went on the record using her name and face, but lots of other sources have confirmed the fact that Moore was a serial creep who was banned from the mall for stalking teenage girls.

    Roy Moore is alleged to have tweeted at Jimmy Kimmel, “Despite D.C. and Hollywood Elites’ bigotry towards southerners, Jimmy, we’ll save you a seat on the front pew,”

    Kimmel, for his part, offered to meet Ol’ Roy at the Gadsden Mall.

    http://www.nhregister.com/news/article/Jimmy-Kimmel-delivers-scathing-response-to-Roy-12397224.php

    Moore wrote, “Jimmy Kimmel, if you want to mock our Christian values, come down here to Alabama and do it man to man.” I responded and he responded back and I responded again, it’s all on Twitter.

    But the bottom line is this: I accept the invitation. I will come down there. What I’m going to do is – I think you’re going to like this, Roy. I’m going to come to Gadsden, Alabama, with a team of high school cheerleaders, OK? We’ll meet you at the mall. Don’t worry, I can get you in.

    And when the girls and I show up, if you can control yourself and behave, if you can somehow manage to keep little Roy in your little cowboy pants when those nubile cheerleaders come bounding in, you and I, we’ll sit down at the food court, we’ll have a little Panda Express and we’ll talk about Christian values.

    Because, and I don’t know, it doesn’t fit your stereotype – but I happen to be a Christian, too. I made my first Holy Communion; I was confirmed; I pray; I support my church; one of my closest friends is a priest; I baptized my children. Christian is actually my middle name. I know that’s shocking, but it’s true.

    So if you’re open to it, when we sit down, I will share with you what I learned at my church. At my church, forcing yourself on underaged girls is a no-no. Some even consider it to be a sin.

  40. paulie Post author

    And further in the same article…

    Or maybe when you say “Come to Alabama and we’ll do it man to man,” maybe you’re challenging me to a fight, which is kind of what it sounds like. And if you are, I accept, by the way. I accept that invitation. There is no one I would love to fight more than you. I will put my Christian values aside just for you and for that fight.

    So if you are challenging me to a fight, here’s what we’ll do. Let’s find a place to do it. I’ll wear a Girl Scout uniform so you can have something to get excited about. And the winner, whoever wins the fight, will give all the money we charge for the tickets to charity. My charity will be the women who came forward to say you molested them, OK? Alright, tough guy, with your little pistol?

    Roy Moore is never – he’s too scared to even debate the guy he’s running against, Doug Jones. With me he wants to go man to man. Maybe if he went man to man instead of man to little girl, you wouldn’t be in this situation. Allegedly. Allegedly!

  41. paulie Post author

    Since Kimmel’s reply implies that he is deathly afraid of attending church services

    How does “I will when you get some Christian values Roy” imply that, praytell?

  42. paulie Post author

    no matter how many pictures of Vladimir Putin you imagine there are in the offices of Breitbart.

    I have no idea what they have in the offices of Breitbart, but I know what the Putinist propaganda line is – I like to read it in the original Russian – and I know what the Breitbart line is. The similarity is striking.

  43. Thane Eichenauer

    paulie,
    A refusal is a refusal no matter the thetrics Kimmel adorns it with or what fancy qualifications he appends to it. This is what he would say if he were willing to go to church: “I accept your offer. Let me know when and where. I’ll be there.” To my eyes Kimmel’s actions look like arguing in bad faith.
    Frankly I am surprised Stephen Colbert hasn’t invited himself.

  44. paulie Post author

    Sounds to me like Lil Pistol Roy is the one who is refusing to meet Kimmel at the mall. As for church, Kimmel already goes to church. Roy Moore can always come to the Synagogue here in Tuscaloosa, but I doubt he would.

  45. Thane Eichenauer

    paulie> Roy Moore can always come to the Synagogue here in Tuscaloosa, but I doubt he would.

    You don’t know if you haven’t made an offer.

    As for Kimmel, nobody has claimed that Kimmel doesn’t go to church. The offer from Moore to Kimmel is come to Alabama for church services. Now if Kimmel dickered over which church that would be dickering I could see as in good faith. Moore is offering a shared experience at church. Kimmel counter offered a circus.

    Frankly Ron Bishop should take up the offer on Kimmel’s behalf.

  46. paulie Post author

    You don’t know if you haven’t made an offer.

    He has an open invitation.

    As for Kimmel, nobody has claimed that Kimmel doesn’t go to church. The offer from Moore to Kimmel is come to Alabama for church services.

    Kimmel isn’t afraid to go to church, or to Alabama. He’s not afraid to meet Roy Moore. Sounds like a lot of wrangling over details.

    Maybe Moore can visit the Islamic Center of Tuscaloosa and the Synagogue here, all in one trip. That would be swell. To be honest, I don’t know what Ron Bishop’s religious allegiance is.

  47. Thane Eichenauer

    paulie> Kimmel isn’t afraid to go to church, or to Alabama. He’s not afraid to meet Roy Moore. Sounds like a lot of wrangling over details.

    The details are definitive. I think you and I and even James Christian “Jimmy” Kimmel isn’t afraid of either Alabama or Roy Moore. Why is it that he doesn’t accept when church is involved? Why paulie why?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Kimmel

    As for which religous service let’s skip Jewish or Islamic services for now. Those are bees that even I have no interested in poking. I personally claim no specific religion. I last attended Catholic mass decades ago.

    Shoot, I wonder if Penn Gillette would show up for church in Alabama with Moore and bring Glenn Beck with him. What a church circus that would be.

  48. paulie Post author

    Why is it Roy Moore doesn’t accept when the Gadsden Mall is involved? Why Thane why?

    I mean he is not really still banned there, is he?

  49. Thane Eichenauer

    paulie,
    The Gadsen mall is clearly an offer to participate in Kimmel’s media circus. Moore’s offer is for shared church service where Kimmel and Compsny would need to behave like good “uh” Christian men should.

    Moore will not walk into a circus. Kimmel will not walk into Moore’s church nor any church in Alabama (oh to be proved wrong). Which one is an example of prudence? Which is an example of fear? One need only ask a reasonable citizen on the streets of Alabama to get an answer (Father Sky God forgive me my apostasy of even suggesting polling).

  50. paulie Post author

    The Gadsen mall is clearly an offer to participate in Kimmel’s media circus.

    It’s a perfectly good place to meet.

    Moore will not walk into a circus.

    Of course he would. He’s the biggest clown in the tent.

    Kimmel will not walk into Moore’s church nor any church in Alabama

    Kimmel isn’t running for office in Alabama. He doesn’t even live here. Moore is, and does. So why “let’s skip Jewish or Islamic services for now” when it’s actually a very pertinent fact that some of us who live here are not Christian and that would seem rather relevant in light of the fact that Moore has said that freedom of religion does not apply to non-Christian religions, that the Bible is the law of the land, that Muslims should not be allowed to hold office and that he is seeking to represent all of the citizens of Alabama, including those of us who are not Christian?

    I think he has some ‘splainin’ to do to Alabama voters who aren’t Christians and that’s more relevant to me than what state Jimmy Kimmel goes to church in.

    Which is an example of fear?

    Well if Lil Pistol Roy is afraid to walk into the main mall in his own home county, decades after he was banned there as a pervert and a public nuisance, while running to represent the whole state in the Senate I would say that certainly crosses the line from prudence to fear.

    And the same holds true if he’s afraid to enter Synagogues and Islamic Centers in the state he is running to represent in the Senate.

  51. paulie Post author

    One need only ask a reasonable citizen on the streets of Alabama …

    Whether you agree I’m reasonable or not I’m a citizen of Alabama and you know my opinion. If the citizens of Alabama are only reasonable if they support Roy Moore that leaves a lot of us out. He didn’t win his own party’s primary by a very big margin and didn’t lead Jones in the polls by much even before any of the current allegations. As of right now, his big lead in the polls is an average of 2%. Here’s what some reasonable citizens of Alabama think of Roy Moore. Granted they are women being quoted in a yankee publication so Moore’s “reasonable” supporters will probably claim the New York paper just made them up or misquoted them:

    I spent much of yesterday speaking with Republican women in Alabama who either have worked or continue to work for conservative causes and candidates. I asked them how Moore’s connection to the Vision Forum textbook could affect the support he receives in the December 12th election, which recent polls give him an edge to win over the Democrat, Doug Jones. (Jones had previously surged ahead in some polling, partly on the strength of female support, but his momentum seems to have ebbed.) Most of the women answered on the record, despite the negative repercussions that doing so could have on their party standing. Elizabeth BeShears is a political-communications consultant based in Birmingham. “In Alabama, we talk all the time about how, historically, the men run but the women are the ones who get them elected,” BeShears told me. “As a woman who has worked hard to get Republicans elected to office, at all levels in the state, it’s extremely worrying to me to know that somebody who’s supposed to represent us at one of the highest levels in the country doesn’t think I’m good enough to serve in any capacity in political leadership.”

    BeShears went on, “For folks under forty in particular, Roy Moore has been a source of embarrassment—not a source of pride—for the majority of our lives. We don’t want to reward that by putting him in the Senate, where he’ll have an even larger stage—or pulpit, as he probably imagines it—to talk about his brand of Christianity. It’s time that the Republican Party in Alabama knows that we’re not going to stand for being told that they have to vote for a person just because they have an ‘R’ beside their name.” Who would BeShears vote for? “I am prayerfully considering voting for Doug Jones.”

    Another powerful female figure in the state Party, who asked to remain unnamed, was more explicit. The textbook’s anti-woman argument was, for her, one of the most damning stories about Moore so far. “Does that mean our governor shouldn’t be governor?” she asked, referring to Kay Ivey. “Our Supreme Court Chief Justice shouldn’t be Supreme Court Chief Justice, and our Republican Party state chairwoman shouldn’t be chairwoman?” (Those positions are currently held by Lyn Stuart and Terry Lathan, respectively.) “Because, I’ll tell you, I wasn’t gonna vote at all until this morning,” she continued. “I wasn’t gonna vote for Moore or Jones. Now I’m voting for Doug Jones. Because if that guy”—Moore—“doesn’t think I need to be anywhere but the kitchen birthing babies, he can kiss my ass.” She added, “I can’t say it publicly because it’ll ruin my career, and I don’t know how to do anything other than politics in Alabama. I would be without income tomorrow. I can’t stand up and say anything. But if I’m not good enough to be in government, then I’m not good enough to vote for him, either.”

    Collier Tynes describes herself as a “Christian, pro-life conservative and lifelong Republican.” Until earlier this year, Tynes worked as the chief of staff to the former Alabama First Lady Dianne Bentley, who is now the ex-wife of the disgraced governor Robert Bentley. Tynes played down the impact of the textbook. “At this point, lifelong Republicans are not surprised by Judge Moore’s association with a book that takes scripture out of context and preaches invalid beliefs,” Tynes told me. “It’s the credible allegations of child molestation against Judge Moore that rightfully have pro-life Christians staying home on Election Day or surrendering their votes to a Republican write-in candidate.” Tynes declined to publicly state for whom she would be voting, though, as she has said elsewhere, it would not be Moore.

    https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/republican-women-in-alabama-sound-off-on-moore

  52. dL

    I think he has some ‘splainin’ to do to Alabama voters who aren’t Christians and that’s more relevant to me than what state Jimmy Kimmel goes to church in.

    Only if you operate under the delusion that representational democracy represents the fiction known as the “public interest.” Otherwise, I would think any rational person would scoff at Moore’s lip service explanation and would refrain from even demanding one.

  53. dL

    My claim might be a bit weak on a percentage of total budget basis but funding is funding.

    The Merida Initiative is drug war bullshit, and you are probably are on the wrong site to try push that as evidence of Mexico being a US welfare puppet.

  54. paulie Post author

    Only if you operate under the delusion that representational democracy represents the fiction known as the “public interest.” Otherwise, I would think any rational person would scoff at Moore’s lip service explanation and would refrain from even demanding one.

    He won’t even offer lip service.

  55. paulie Post author

    The Merida Initiative is drug war bullshit, and you are probably are on the wrong site to try push that as evidence of Mexico being a US welfare puppet.

    Particularly in the original context, that this would somehow prevent the US from becoming involved in future wars anywhere in Latin America.

  56. Chuck Moulton

    Wow! I am continuously astounded at the ever higher lengths you all are willing to go to discarding all logic, common sense , and principles to throw someone you don’t like under the bus. I’ve known Paulie for a long time and my estimation of his intelligence and fidelity to liberty have gone down significantly in the last few weeks.

    This is the first I had heard of this Vision Forum controversy, as I don’t follow the news closely. So I read up on it… and yet again there is no “there” there. Did Roy Moore say any of these things about not wanting women to vote or hold office? No he did not. What was cited was a lecture by a completely different person in a series of courses for which Moore also contributed. That would be equivalent to a university professor being raked over the coals for what a completely different professor said. It would be like me attacking Paulie as anti-immigration and racist because he petitioned with another fellow — Andy — who made a few crazy remarks.

    Yet again you all have succeeded in making Roy Moore — a scumbag with whom I completely disagree politically — into the victim. And yet again I feel sorry for him. It’s amazing how you all manage to do that. AMAZING!

    It’s very hard to express in words how surprised, confused, and annoyed I am that people I used to respect have thrown their own reputations for honesty and straight shooting into the gutter because they don’t like this Roy Moore guy… repeatedly and consistently declining to stick to the many factual reasons to attack him, instead preferring to make shit up and mislead people.

    AMAZING!! AMAZING!!!

  57. paulie Post author

    I don’t think I mislead anyone. Roy Moore has never supported a woman for office, and hangs around with a bunch of people who say women should not be allowed to run for office, lends his name to their projects, etc. It’s true that Andy is a personal friend of mine but if you read my own words there are plenty of examples of how I am not anti-immigration in the least. Where are the statements from Moore than contradict his co-authors in that book?

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