Florida Governor Candidate John Wayne Smith Removed From List of Candidates on LP.org

John Wayne Smith

———- Forwarded message ———-
From: Wes Benedict
Date: Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 8:55 PM
Subject: Re: Florida candidate – governorwwww
To: LPF chair
Cc: Dana Moxley-Cummings <>, , Carla Howell <carla.howell@lp.org>, Bob Johnston , Alex , Treasurer , Lynn House

Dana Moxley Cummings,

A quick summary of our practice, which varies in some cases, is that we try to list and write news articles about whatever candidates we’re aware of for most states, and try to treat them evenly and positively, but often defer to state chair preferences when we’re aware of them. So per your request we’ll remove John Wayne Smith from our candidate list (probably tomorrow) and we will try to run others by you (or check the LPF website) in the future before listing. We apologize for the inconvenience. Please be aware that sometimes my personal decisions get over-ruled and sometimes I change my mind based on additional information or the realization that I made a dumb decision in the first place.

In any case, I’m glad to hear about so much interest in the LP in Florida.

Take care,

Wes Benedict, Executive Director
Libertarian National Committee, Inc.
2600 Virginia Ave. NW, Suite 200
Washington, DC 20037
(202) 333-0008 ext. 232, wes.benedict@lp.org
Join the Libertarian Party at: http://lp.org/membership
On 9/3/2013 3:06 PM, Dana Moxley-Cummings wrote:

I appreciate it! I know, I myself have contacted Bob Johnston for some clarification on the matter. I see he is copied on this email as well so I’m glad we are all able to be on the same page as we figure this out. I have also added the LPF Vice-Chair, Treasurer, and Secretary to the conversation. Please let me know if you need any official copies of the LPF governing documents to aid in National’s understanding of the position the leadership of the LPF has been asked to take by the majority of our delegates.

In Liberty,
Dana Moxley Cummings

On Tuesday, September 3, 2013, Wes Benedict wrote:

Hi, we’ve received a few complaints here at headquarters about our publications regarding Governor in Florida. We’ll get back to you in a day or two about this. I apologize for the delay.


Wes Benedict, Executive Director
Libertarian National Committee, Inc.
2600 Virginia Ave. NW, Suite 200
Washington, DC 20037
(202) 333-0008 ext. 232wes.benedict@lp.org
Join the Libertarian Party at: http://lp.org/membership

Dana Moxley Cummings

Chairman

Libertarian Party of Florida
1334 Tampa Road, Suite 2
Palm Harbor, Florida 34683

Toll Free:  1855-FLA-FREE (855-352-3733)

 

Website: www.lpf.org

Email: chairchair@lpf.org

50 thoughts on “Florida Governor Candidate John Wayne Smith Removed From List of Candidates on LP.org

  1. Joe Wendt

    This is a bs, JWS should be listed on the national site; how the hell are people going to know that there’s a primary.

  2. Vincent

    The point is for there not to be a primary. The LPF is doing everything it can to make sure Wyllie makes it to the general election.

  3. Libertariangirl

    while i certainly dont like the decision i respect it. we cant say on one hand let state affiliates have autonomy and then on the otherhand overrule them . the solutionto this dilemma , REPLACE LPF CHAIR DANA MOXLEY AND THE LPF EXCOM.

  4. Alex Snitker

    JWS had refused to be vetted.

    The truth is that we actually want a primary for Governor. JWS could be that candidate if he chooses to but has refused to go through the vetting process.

    What is the vetting process? All you are required to do is fill out a questionnaire specifically relating to the LPF platform. If you agree with the party 80% that candidate comes up for a vote.

    Many on the EC who support another candidate have already made it clear that we will be abstaining from voting. In addition, the chair of the candidates committee has stepped down due to a perceived bias.

    It should also be noted that the Chairmanship of this committee was actually offered to Mike Kane (a strong supporter of JWS). He refused to chair the committee citing that he was too busy.

  5. Thomas L. Knapp

    “JWS had refused to be vetted.”

    As well he should have.

    In real political parties, voters choose the candidate via primary.

    In political parties that are trying to be real political parties but don’t have primary ballot access or are located in non-primary states, the members choose the candidates in convention.

    A group that “vets” candidates instead of letting the members or voters choose among them isn’t a political party and isn’t trying to be a political party. It’s just a clique playing control games.

  6. Mike Kane

    Excellent points Mr. Knapp. I understand you are no longer active with the LP however I would encourage you to get involved, and put any personal issues aside.

  7. Mike Kane

    I am not supporting anyone yet for Governor here in the state of Florida. There is still plenty of time for other people to file to run and after the deadline is over, I will make an official endorsement.

    I would hope and encourage all EC members to try to state neutral through this process until the filing deadline is up, but it’s crystal clear that they haven’t been and will continue to be biased.

  8. LPF_Useless_Troll

    Mike,

    I love how useless you are. You make me feel great about myself and how I sit around, accomplish nothing, and try to destroy the ideas of others who are making a real effort to advance the LPF.

    I wish I was as good as you were at driving members away from the party because of your attitude. You really are a top book-club faction talent. We need more like you who are hell bent on doing everything they can to make this party stay in the depths.

    Unfortunately, people like Alex Snitker and the LPF EC are really giving us a good beating. They are registering people, visiting county affiliates, getting media exposure, and recruiting electable candidates.

    I yearn for the good old days of running disturbed people that barely register at the polls (if they even qualify).

  9. Alex Snitker

    “As well he should have.

    In real political parties, voters choose the candidate via primary.”

    Voters choose the nominee here in Florida. The reason for the vetting process is simple. The Libertarian Party of Florida cannot stop anyone from running as a Libertarian. So if a communist ran as a Libertarian there is nothing we could do to stop that. In order to let the voters know more information about candidates we ask them to fill out a questionnaire that shows that they support the platform.

    This was something that the delegation spoke about in depth. There were members of the EC who oppose the vetting and voiced their opposition at that time but the delegation voted for it. It is up to the EC to respect the vote of the delegation.

    “In political parties that are trying to be real political parties but don’t have primary ballot access or are located in non-primary states, the members choose the candidates in convention.”

    Again you have a misunderstanding of the process. Like I said earlier this is in place and any person who agrees with the platform 80% would make it through vetting.

    “A group that “vets” candidates instead of letting the members or voters choose among them isn’t a political party and isn’t trying to be a political party. It’s just a clique playing control games.”

    The Libertarian Party of Florida cannot stop anyone from running and if there are two Libertarians who run for office there will be a primary.

  10. Dana Cummings

    We certainly do want a primary! We would prefer a primary of 2 vetted candidates, unfortunately JWS refused to be vetted. I act upon the will of the majority of the membership. If you want me replaced….then get out there and change the minds of the majority and replace me. I put in 60 hours of work a week for free, and Mike Kane can’t even get an affiliate started. His idea of putting in work is all of this nonsense. JWS being on the national site will have NO effect on who will win the primary. What it has an effect on ….is the people’s perception of the type of individuals the LPF approves of as representatives of the LPF. NAP violator JWS, is not one of them. When the membership speaks, I listen and I act. It seems what Mike Kane did here is display that I am doing a great job representing the members of the LPF. Thank you Mike. Keep posting….Maybe one of these days I will have enough time to post some of what you have said…or some audio of you and how you act on our EC calls. or….is your transparency bit…just all for show?

  11. Thomas L. Knapp

    AS @ 10,

    You could be right. I could be misunderstanding.

    Are you saying that this “vetting” is entirely optional on the candidate’s part and that it has no bearing on whether or not the candidate appears on the primary ballot?

  12. Steve M

    Some real basic questions..

    1) Does the Libertarian Party of Florida have a ” Electoral Victory Committee”? who is its chair who are its members? If you don’t is it the executive committee that is doing the vetting?

    2) Does vetting consist of more then “confirming that they are members of the State Party and registered to vote in the state as Libertarians.”

  13. Steve M

    However Thomas… the State Party then uses State Party resources such as their web site to promote only the “approved” candidates and then request that the national party not display un-approved candidates on the National party web site.

    And as an early thread stated… the State Party also threatens other state and county officials who doen’t support the approved candidates.

  14. Alex Snitker

    Thomas,

    “Are you saying that this “vetting” is entirely optional on the candidate’s part and that it has no bearing on whether or not the candidate appears on the primary ballot?”

    Yes the vetting has nothing to do with the candidate getting their name on the ballot. The Libertarian party has no control over that.

  15. Alex Snitker

    “Some real basic questions..

    1) Does the Libertarian Party of Florida have a ” Electoral Victory Committee”? who is its chair who are its members? If you don’t is it the executive committee that is doing the vetting?”

    The LPF has a candidates committee. It was chaired by Danielle Alexandre but she resigned as soon as we thought that there was going to be another vetted candidate. She is also the campaign manager for Adrian Wyllie.

    We offered the position to Mike Kane but he refused to chair the committee and at the time the reason he gave was that he was too busy.

    “2) Does vetting consist of more then “confirming that they are members of the State Party and registered to vote in the state as Libertarians.”

    They also fill out a questionnaire that specifically deals with the state platform. If they agree with 80% of the state platform they are moved past vetting and the EC votes on the candidate. As of Sept 2013 nobody has been rejected from vetting.

  16. Alex Snitker

    “However Thomas… the State Party then uses State Party resources such as their web site to promote only the “approved” candidates and then request that the national party not display un-approved candidates on the National party web site.”

    Are you saying that we should just let anyone who wants to be on the site to be on there? Are you saying that there should be no vetting process?

    There are those who would agree with you but the delegates at the state convention voted and vetting was something that the Libertarians at the convention voted on. As the EC it is our job to carry out our business as the delegates requested whether we agree or not.

    “And as an early thread stated… the State Party also threatens other state and county officials who doen’t support the approved candidates.”

    This is completely untrue. I don’t know where you heard this but if you have proof then by all means you can produce it.

  17. Steve M

    The LP bylaws and Standing Rules do not allow any committee other then an ”Electoral Victory Committee” or the executive committee to do the vetting.

    ARTICLE IV Election of Officers, Directors, Candidates

    Section 1. All candidates for office and political office may be asked to confirm certain basic principles before the convention This may be delegated to the Nominating Committee for candidates for party office (including Delegates to the National Convention of the Libertarian Party and Presidential Electors) and to the Electoral Victory Committee for Candidates for political office, and includes confirming that they are members of the State Party and registered to vote in the state as Libertarians. (Passed by the Executive Committee 1-16-93, delineating 2 committees, Executive Committee, 7-10-93, amended by the Executive Committee 3-6-96 and 7-27-96)

    Now under what authority did you add a requirement that to be vetted beyond party membership and being a registered libertarian voter? Was this done by the executive committee or by some other committee? Was this done at a state party convention?

    I am saying I hope loud and clear that the executive committee should not take from the registered libertarians the right to determine who their candidates are going to be in the general election. That the officers of the party should not use the resources of the party to support one libertarian candidate over another until after the primary is completed.

  18. Mark Axinn

    Dana @ 11 said “I put in 60 hours of work a week for free.”

    This is a real problem. Being an effective State Chair basically means taking on a second full-time job. It would be nice if we did not also have to spend inordinate amount of our time putting out flame wars.

    I understand that Florida has a tremendous number of excellent candidates, including the prior state chair Mr. Wyllie. It is a benefit to have a treasure trove of good people; try not to waste it.

  19. Joe Wendt

    “As of Sept 2013 nobody has been rejected from vetting.”

    Funny, I seem to remember someone not getting vetted due to someone’s objection over a criticism of Adrian’s stances. And then following that, after the LPF EC decided to not vet candidates in local non-partisan races (and hence forth not have on their site), look who they have on their site a candidate for a local non-partisan election. Wow, guess it’s different rules for different folks.

  20. Mike Kane

    Alex writes “Voters choose the nominee here in Florida. The reason for the vetting process is simple. The Libertarian Party of Florida cannot stop anyone from running as a Libertarian. So if a communist ran as a Libertarian there is nothing we could do to stop that. In order to let the voters know more information about candidates we ask them to fill out a questionnaire that shows that they support the platform. ”

    Yes there is a way to stop it and that’s run a candidate against them in the primary…

    See, that’s the problem with leadership in the LPF. ZERO forward thinking.

  21. Mike Kane

    @Steve M

    The LPF’s bylaws, constitution, and standing rules are all in direct conflict with each other — and also very ivory tower, private club, all inclusive etc, call it what you want.

    The fact is that if you don’t agree with their agenda, they will make a point of trying to discredit you to the point where you want to quit. They will strawman and red herring you to death over simple statements, and when you point out fallacies, they will resort to ad hominem attacks and flat out lies to promote their agenda.

    Short of a handful of people, I’ve never met a libertarian who I agreed with 100%. Almost all the time, we call it a simple disagreement and move on. These folks on the other hand don’t understand the concept of agreeing to disagree and just moving on. Rather, they’d prefer to attack peoples hard work and activism, name call — such as calling people “Cancer that needs removed”, and block lines of communication.

    I hate to say this, but I think Alex Snitker and Tom Stevens share the same gene pool.

  22. Steve M

    The point is that the Executive committee seems to be playing Calvin Ball. They seem to be making up the rules as they go and that inherently looks unfair. If not dictatorial.

    This is a threat….It states do what I want or I will try to fire you.

    “If Vicki fails to address this issue I will deem her derelict in her position as LNC Regional Rep and convene with the Georgia and Tennessee state chair’s to discuss her removal from that position.”

  23. Steve M

    Alex Snitker,

    You didn’t address my other questions about your vetting of candidates…

    Now under what authority did you add a requirement that to be vetted beyond party membership and being a registered libertarian voter? Was this done by the executive committee or by some other committee? Was this done at a state party convention?

  24. matt s

    Joe, last time I checked it’s illegal for political parties to endorse or support candidates inother parties or nonpartisan races.

  25. Steve M

    Matt s, thanks where are the minutes of this state convention published? specifically the requiring answering a questionnaire and what questions are on the questionnaire and how the answers are graded.

    “They also fill out a questionnaire that specifically deals with the state platform. If they agree with 80% of the state platform they are moved past vetting and the EC votes on the candidate. As of Sept 2013 nobody has been rejected from vetting.”

  26. Joe Wendt

    matt s, check the LPF website, they list a candidate in Hialeah (which is a non-partisan race).

  27. Dana Cummings

    Mike Kane, you remind me of a character that MTV would love for some trashy reality show. This extremely tiny faction of you and your friends are such self-sentered whiners and YOU have made it the most obvious of all. I will say, it is interesting to see what you will come up with next….but you must realize….Actions speak louder than words.

  28. Jake Porter

    The enemy is not in the Libertarian Party! The enemy is the one creating wars, spying on American citizens, running up the national debt, etc.

    It is amazing that we feel the need to question everyone’s motives and make negative comments about people and try to drive people away from the party which isn’t very large anyway.

    Sometimes the best thing is to agree to disagree and settle it diplomatically. I know if an executive committee member called me a self-centered whiner on a public forum I would probably not have good feelings about ever helping that person out again. When I served as an Alternate on the LNC I had several disagreements and arguments with Aaron Starr and Bob Sullentrop, but if I were to see them today we would be able to have a conversation and probably work together on several issues if they ever asked. They never questioned my motives and I never questioned their motives.

  29. Dana Cummings

    Mike Kane has never helped us out in the first place. When you start to have members leaving the party because the “leaders” don’t have the courage to tell it like it is…well then it’s time for us to step up. I represent the membership of the LPF. Not the fan club of the destructive minority.

  30. Robert Capozzi

    35JP: The enemy is not in the Libertarian Party!

    me: And yet someone in the LP felt the need to narc on other Ls. And yet you apparently feel the need to defend the narcer.

    Why?

  31. Mike Kane

    You’re right Dana, the 100’s of phone calls, emails, time spent on meetings here in my county and helping the Miami Dade affiliate mean nothing.

    It costs us around $75 to attend each Miami Dade meeting (3 hour drive one way, with tolls). When I give a membership and fundraising speech at the meeting (which the members ask me to do), that’s not helping.

    Folks — this is typical LPF leadership behavior. Look past any hard work and activism and criticize for not supporting one candidate over another.

  32. Mike Kane

    Of course the time I spend doing LP activism is obviously a burden on other activities I could be doing, such as making money for myself or spending it leisurely.

  33. Jill Pyeatt

    Dana, I don’t know you or any of the Florida folk in person, but I’ve dealt with Mike Kane, Steve La Bianca, and John Wayne Smith for a couple years on FB and this forum, and none of them have ever seemed whiny to me. Just FYI

  34. Victor Lazlo

    Dana @ 36: good for you for refusing to bow down to the “destructive minority.” They and their ilk are ruining this party all across the country. There can be no peaceful accommodation with them.

  35. Victor Lazlo

    Mike Kane @ 39: you should stop your LP activism and spend the time making money or on leisure. It would make the world a better place all the way around.

  36. Victor Lazlo

    Jill Pyeatt @ 40: that says more about you than anything else, and none of it its good. All I know about those three, I learned here on IPR. It is clear to any thinking person that they are bad news and what is undermining and even destroying the LP. You need to think about yourself long and hard and figure out why you can’t see that.

  37. Jake Porter

    @37

    Different situation. George tried to go through the LNC to get answers, there was a potential for fraud which despite what some may believe is not a libertarian virtue, and then he filed a paper asking for questions. Since there appears to be no wrong doing nothing happened. In fact, there is only one person still yammering on about it four years later. Had there been wrong doing and George did nothing everyone would be attacking him for not stopping it when he had information that something didn’t look right.

    Here, we are not talking about party finances but people insulting activists on a public forum for the voters to see. I will also note that there is a huge difference between a leader and a manager. You can’t manage volunteers. You can organize them, you can lead them, but you cannot force them to do what you want.

    As a side note, if I was in Flordia I would have no problem supporting Adrian for Governor.

  38. Steve M

    Robert Carpozzi,

    Why do you support LP officials that hide the activities of the LP from its members? The act of LP party officials to preselect candidates, usurping a task that belongs to the registered voters is not conducive to wanting to have Libertarian politicians elected.

    To be different from the democan/republicrats the Libertarian Party must open, clean and honest.

    As long as County, State and National Party officers continue to think they know whats best over the rights of the party members this party isn’t going anywhere.

  39. Adrian Wyllie

    I’d like to state for the record that I would sincerely welcome a primary challenger in the Florida gubernatorial race. Nothing would be better for the party than a hard-fought primary battle between two or more viable Libertarian candidates who could articulate our platform to the voters. It would generate interest in the LP, and give people an additional reason to switch their voter registration.

    I hope that someone with those capabilities steps up and runs for the position soon.

    However, John Wayne Smith and his Lt. Governor candidate Joe Wendt are not serious candidates. They are not actively campaigning. They have not raised a single dollar in campaign funding. Smith’s behavior is consistently aggressive and antisocial, and he has no legitimate platform.

    Earlier in the campaign, I attempted to treat JWS as serious competitor. Even though he had a long history of threatening and attempting violence against me and other LPF members, I still agreed to publicly debate him at the Orange County LP affiliate.

    During that debate, he shouted at me, calling me “a liar, a thief, and a bastard!” When I challenged him to present evidence to support his claims, he was unable to do so. He said he was waiting until next year to present the “evidence.” Later in the debate, he turned his wrath on members of the audience, shouting at and berating some of them as well. When one audience member asked him a question about his position on taxes for entitlement programs, Smith shouted, “That’s none of your damn business!”

    Today, Mr. Smith has publicly announced he is filing criminal “cyber bullying” charges against at least 20 members of the LPF. This further underscores his instability, and his preference to use the force of government to achieve his political goals.

    I hope that Alex George decides to enter the race. He is better suited to clearly articulate Libertarian values to the voters than JWS, even though Mr. George comes from the right-wing of the Libertarian Party.

  40. LibertarianGirl

    What is the right-wing of the Libertarian Party?

    and I agree the criminal charges things seemed way over the top when I read it this morn. Why must we invoke the State against eachother?

    that should , if ever used , be reserved for the most egregious of crimes ,

    in other news its looking like NV will hold its convention w/o contention and infighting 🙂 THRILLED. and that FLA is taking our spot for most dramatic infighting….

  41. Joe Wendt

    Right-wing of the Libertarian Party? Considering that one candidate has been actively recruiting TEA Party-ers and has a fmr Constitution Party member as his camapign treasurer, I really dont’ think it’s appropriate for that candidate to call anyone else right-wing.

    Also, since the establishment’s candidate refuses to identify himself as a Libertarian on their campaign literature (bumper stickers and such), why should anyone consider that candidate a legitimate candidate? Adrian’s done that.

    And speaking of flaws, wasn’t the LPF sued under Adrian’s leadership because they devetted a candidate over his stance on the Trayvon Martin shooting? And wasn’t that candidate victorious in court? Yes, that happened. These people don’t want people to dissent from their dictated party line; they want mindless smiling faces obediently following them regardless of contradiction of principles. They don’t want a Libertarian Party run by individuals, they want a collectivist cult.

    JWS isn’t the problem in this election, Wyllie and his crew are the problem.

  42. Dave Blue

    Victor @ 43: it astounds that you were able to extrapolate all that about jill from her one mild comment.

  43. paulie

    This is a bs, JWS should be listed on the national site; how the hell are people going to know that there’s a primary.

    The national LP’s policy is to defer to state affiliates in deciding which candidates to list and which candidates not to list on the national website, and this policy applies to all the states. As for Florida voters knowing that there is a primary, that is covered in sample ballots, newspapers (if nothing else, by publishing sample ballots), sites such as this one, the actual election ballot – any number of ways.

    The point is for there not to be a primary. The LPF is doing everything it can to make sure Wyllie makes it to the general election.

    There is a primary, which is mandated by the state, and LPF can do nothing about it.

    In real political parties, voters choose the candidate via primary.

    In political parties that are trying to be real political parties but don’t have primary ballot access or are located in non-primary states, the members choose the candidates in convention.

    A group that “vets” candidates instead of letting the members or voters choose among them isn’t a political party and isn’t trying to be a political party. It’s just a clique playing control games.

    In many states, Republicans and Democrats vet their candidates and in some states (including here in Alabama) unvetted Demopublicans can be kept off the primary ballot altogether. The Democrats and Republicans still, at least in theory, choose their presidential candidates in convention. Why is choosing candidates by convention instead of primary inherently bad? If the taxvictim subsidies to political party primaries stopped, I bet a lot of Democrats and Republicans would be nominated by conventions.

    is the vetting mandatory to being voted on to be the Libertarian candidate at LPF’s state convention?

    The convention does not pick the candidate, the primary does. Vetting is not mandatory to be in the primary. However the state party treats unvetted candidates as persona non grata, for example not listing them on the state party website and asking national to do same.

    Funny, I seem to remember someone not getting vetted due to someone’s objection over a criticism of Adrian’s stances. And then following that, after the LPF EC decided to not vet candidates in local non-partisan races (and hence forth not have on their site), look who they have on their site a candidate for a local non-partisan election. Wow, guess it’s different rules for different folks.

    That sounds like a legitimate complaint. Any response from anyone on LPF EC?

    wasn’t the LPF sued under Adrian’s leadership because they devetted a candidate over his stance on the Trayvon Martin shooting? And wasn’t that candidate victorious in court? Yes, that happened.

    Any response from LPF leadership?

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