2020 Presidential Election Predictions

Make your predictions for the 2020 presidential election in the comments below.

Here’s some questions to consider:

  1. Who will win the election?
  2. Are the polls accurate?
  3. What will the Electoral College vote be?.
  4. What percentage of the vote will Jo Jorgensen receive?
  5. What will be Jorgensen’s strongest state?
  6. What percentage of the vote will Howie Hawkins receive?
  7. What will be Hawkins’ strongest state?
  8. How many write-in votes will Bernie Sanders receive?
  9. What third party or independent candidate will surprise?
  10. What third party or independent candidate will disappoint?

 

59 thoughts on “2020 Presidential Election Predictions

  1. Jake Leonard

    Who will win the election? If it’s Trump or Biden, America is fucked either way!
    Are the polls accurate? When they don’t include Jorgensen or Hawkins? Hell no – they’re faker than professional wrestling.
    What will the Electoral College vote be? Long shot – but I’d like for it to be tied in the Electoral College.

    What percentage of the vote will Jo Jorgensen receive? I think 5% is a strong possibility compared to 3.3% in 2016.
    What will be Jorgensen’s strongest state? Wyoming might be one of the strongest. State regionwise, considering where Jo is originally from, she could turn some serious numbers in the Chicagoland region. I state that with the combination of U.S. Senate nominee Danny Malouf, two Congressional candidates in Bill Redpath and Preston Nelson, candidates in several Illinois House races in the region and our rare diamond in the rough, a Libertarian in the Cook County State’s Attorney race.

    What percentage of the vote will Howie Hawkins receive? Jill Stein got 1.07% in 2016 and 0.36% in 2012. Likely less than 1%
    What will be Hawkins’ strongest state? He’ll likely get a decent showing in states that only require 2% or 3% to retain eased ballot access restrictions and minor/recognized/major party status, but that’s about it.

    How many write-in votes will Bernie Sanders receive? Who the hell would be stupid enough to do that? He didn’t file papers to be a write-in candidate and really shouldn’t due to sore loser laws.

    What third party or independent candidate will surprise? Jorgensen, for sure. Maybe Hawkins.
    What third party or independent candidate will disappoint? But these candidates on the ballot in less than 20 states — La Riva, De La Fuente, Blankenship, Pierce, West, Carroll, Simmons — expect to be disappointed with their results.

  2. Fred Stein

    End result: the people will lose. ………….. Joe Biden will win the electoral college 290 to trump 248 , and of course win popular vote. Jo will get 2 percent, howie one percent. Best state for the Greens will be New York. Best state for Jo Alaska………………………..Sorry gang, it was tough year when the media ignored thrid parties and turned it into a referendum on Trump………………………….Start planning for the next election if this is one?

  3. SocraticGadfly

    Biden, with 50-50 odds he hits Trump’s 2016 304 EVs. Polls are accurate.
    Dunno what Jorgensen’s best state will be. She’ll get 80-90 percent of Johnson 2016. Due to state restrictions, in part, and also due to some Green wingnuts’ disenchantment, Hawkins will only get about 60 percent of Stein 2016. Presidentially? La Riva will surprise. Bernie will get about 10 percent of Hawkins.

    Working on a post for Monday at my blog with this and more.

  4. SocraticGadfly

    Contra Jake Leonard, no way in hell Jo gets 5 percent. Are there more glue-sniffing Libertarian diehards here?

    And, as we enter an even more problematic coronavirus period, Jorgensen will then go back to peddling antivaxxer BS more ardently on Nov. 4 and many Libertarians will continue to go about willful ignorance and denialism about what “public health” menas.

  5. Steven R Linnabary

    Who will win the election?

    Some Boomer draft dodger

    Are the polls accurate?

    How can a poll be accurate if it doesn’t include all the candidates?

    What will the Electoral College vote be?.

    538

    What percentage of the vote will Jo Jorgensen receive?

    3% in most places, out polling JG 4 years ago except in NM

    What will be Jorgensen’s strongest state?

    Alaska, hands down.

    What percentage of the vote will Howie Hawkins receive?

    .5%

    What will be Hawkins’ strongest state?

    I doubt anybody will be able to tell. Hawkins will probably do well in a few precincts. These precincts will be highly touted as proof of the dialectic.

    How many write-in votes will Bernie Sanders receive?

    Most places do not count write-in votes, especially those not officially registered in the SoS offices around the country.
    But I suspect that Sanders will have the most write-ins, even including the official write-in candidates. Ron Paul will likely also poll some write-ins. FWIW: more people will write in and misspell Mickey Mouse (even though there is a song that spells it out) than will vote for Sanders, Paul, or any of the official write-in candidates.

    What third party or independent candidate will surprise?

    All the opposition parties will have something to point to. LP will have AK, GP will have a few precincts, Brock Pierce will probably have a surprising showing somewhere.

    What third party or independent candidate will disappoint?

    Ultimately all will be disappointed over all. Unless they are in it for the long haul knowing it’s going to be a long, hard, slog.

    Races to watch Tuesday night:

    US Senate in AR (Ricky Harrington);

    PEACE

  6. Thomas Knapp

    “Who will win the election?”

    Joe Biden.

    “Are the polls accurate?”

    More so than in 2016, but there are still problems.

    “What will the Electoral College vote be?.”

    Biden 319 electoral votes , Trump 219. State by state map here.

    What percentage of the vote will Jo Jorgensen receive?

    Between 1% and 2% of the aggregate national vote.

    “What will be Jorgensen’s strongest state?”

    No idea. Best guess would be New Mexico (Johnson 2016 spillover) or New Hampshire (strong Libertarian Party and libertarian movement presence).

    “What percentage of the vote will Howie Hawkins receive?”

    Between 0.5% and 1%.

    “What will be Hawkins’ strongest state?”

    No idea. Best guess, Vermont.

    —–
    How many write-in votes will Bernie Sanders receive?
    What third party or independent candidate will surprise?
    What third party or independent candidate will disappoint?
    —–

    No opinion on the first two, “all of them” on the last one.

  7. Ryan

    Who will win the election? Biden.
    Are the polls accurate? More or less. Think Trump will perform slightly better than polls say due to his partisans not answering polls.
    What will the Electoral College vote be? I say Biden 312, Trump 226.
    What percentage of the vote will Jo Jorgensen receive? 1.7%
    What will be Jorgensen’s strongest state? Indiana
    What percentage of the vote will Howie Hawkins receive? 0.5%
    What will be Hawkins’ strongest state? New York
    How many write-in votes will Bernie Sanders receive? Officially counted: zero
    What third party or independent candidate will surprise? Carroll, La Riva, De La Fuente
    What third party or independent candidate will disappoint? Blankenship, Hawkins

  8. Ryan

    Some other questions:

    1. What percentage of the vote does Donald Rainwater get for Governor in Indiana?
    2. Who finishes last and next-to-last of the 21 candidates on the Vermont presidential ballot?

  9. Shawn Levasseur

    Only one prediction, Jorgensen’s strongest state: Maine.

    This is predicated on Ranked Choice Voting being used, and my personal biases as I live in Maine.

  10. Ryan

    Another question:

    Who finishes 5th for president between De La Fuente, La Riva, Blankenship, and Pierce and Kanye as outsider shots?

  11. Thomas Knapp

    Shawn,

    Good point. In thinking about her strongest state, Maine using RCV had slipped my mind. I’ll be interested to see how many votes she racks up, especially “first choice” votes.

  12. theButterfly

    1. Donald Trump.
    2. No.
    3. Similar to 2016.
    4. <1%
    5. Maine.
    6. <0.5%
    7. Maine.
    8. How many did he get in 2016? Less than that.
    9. Gloria La Riva.
    10. Jo Jorgensen.

  13. Longtime Reader

    1. Trump
    2. Not at all, like last election.
    3. Ideally I’m hoping for Helmut Norpoth’s numbers (look up his Primary Election Model for reference).
    4. At least 1%
    5. Alaska
    6. About 0.1 to 0.5%. He hasn’t been the strongest Green candidate compared to Jill Stein.
    7. I’d say California. Since Biden’s going to carry that state either way, might as well “waste a vote” on someone that isn’t him.
    8. Probably only 10k.
    9. I’m hoping that the draft ticket of Jesse Ventura in Alaska will get into the double digits in that state.
    10. The biggest disappointment will be Phil Collins not breaking any records on votes and percent for the Prohibition Party.

  14. William Saturn Post author

    Who will win the election? Like in 2016, Trump wins the electoral college and places second in the popular vote.
    Are the polls accurate? No. The Shy Trump voter effect is in full force.
    What will the Electoral College vote be?. 285 for Trump to 253 for Biden. https://www.270towin.com/maps/784j9
    What percentage of the vote will Jo Jorgensen receive? 1.2 percent
    What will be Jorgensen’s strongest state? Montana
    What percentage of the vote will Howie Hawkins receive? 0.3
    What will be Hawkins’ strongest state? New York
    How many write-in votes will Bernie Sanders receive? ~3 percent in VT
    What third party or independent candidate will surprise? Brian Carroll, Kanye West
    What third party or independent candidate will disappoint? Rocky De La Fuente, Howie Hawkins

  15. Thomas Knapp

    “The Shy Trump voter effect is in full force.”

    In 2016, my model had something of a “shy Trump voter” component. Even if it was “in full force” then — and it wasn’t (Trafalgar predicted a Trump “shy voter” margin of victory in Michigan that turned out to be seven times as large as the reality) — it’s considerably diminished now.

    For one thing, real, honest-to-God “shy Trump voters” in 2016 had some reason to be shy. They were supporting a supposed non-politician with no electoral experience or credentials and who was outside the mainstream, and they didn’t want to be laughed at. This year Trump IS the mainstream. He is the sitting President of the United States, he has been for four years, and he has either vindicated the expectations of the 2016 “shy Trump voter” (in which case there’s no reason to be shy about supporting him) or he hasn’t (in which case that voter is no longer a Trump voter, “shy” or otherwise).

    For another, a lot of the “shy Trump voter” wasn’t about actual shyness — that is, unwillingness to truthfully state who he or she intended to vote for. It was more a function of pollsters approaching “likely voters,” with much of Trump’s base being composed of “not likely voters” — people who either didn’t register to vote until he enthused them, or who were registered but hadn’t voted in the last couple of elections. This year, all of those voters are “likely voters” and far more likely to be captured in polling.

    In 2016, the “shy Trump voter” idea affected my model as follows: I held that in any state where Hillary Clinton polled less than 5% ahead of Donald Trump, she was either neck and neck with, or behind, him, and part of that 5% was “shy voter” possibilities.

    This year, that supposition is probably a little bit smaller than 5%, but it’s also probably in Biden’s favor, not Trump’s, because much of it is made up less of “shy voter” syndrome (although there’s almost certainly a little bit of among Biden’s supporters in rural areas) than with the fact that a voter who is “undecided” as of October is probably not going to vote for the incumbent (he’s had four years to decide he likes the incumbent — if he hasn’t decided he does by now, he doesn’t).

  16. William Saturn Post author

    “They were supporting a supposed non-politician with no electoral experience or credentials and who was outside the mainstream, and they didn’t want to be laughed at. ”

    I don’t agree with this description of the Shy Trump vote. Shy Trump Voters were/are afraid of being labeled as “racist”, “sexist”, or any other kind of bigot label. They are afraid of violence against their selves or property, losing their job, and/or losing relationships with friends and family as a consequence of political association. The mainstream media is even more heavily tilted against Trump now than in 2016. Political violence and rioting, or at least the perception of it, is at a higher rate than in 2016. The BLM movement has become more prominent now than in 2016, particular in sports leagues, and they have made it clear that any support for Trump is racist.

    If anything, the Shy Trump vote will be greater in 2020 than in 2016. My prediction for a lower Trump vote in 2020 than 2016, however, is based on demographic shifts as well as voter perception of Biden as compared to Hillary. Biden will likely win the popular vote by a wider margin than Hillary but the Electoral College advantage for Trump will ultimately prevail.

  17. Thomas Knapp

    We obviously disagree on the “shy Trump voter’s” motivations. But even given the set of motivations you posit, the people in question have been emboldened by four years of Trump. They’re coming out of the woodwork, not blending further into it. At least the ones who genuinely believe that Trump MADE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN are. The ones who don’t believe that aren’t Trump voters anymore.

  18. Tony From Long Island

    Who will win? – Biden

    Polls accurate? For the most part

    Electoral College – Biden 335 – Trump 203

    Jorgensen – 1.75%

    Jorgensen’s strongest state – Alaska

    Hawkins 0.9%

    Hawkins strongest state – Hawaii or Maine

    Bernie Write-In Votes – close to zero

    3rd party candidate to surprise – none

    3rd party candidate to disappoint – Kanye

  19. SocraticGadfly

    Knapp also gets it right versus Saturn on “shy Trump voters.”

    To more bluntly riff off Thomas, for William’s benefit?

    “There is no such fucking thing as a ‘shy Trump voter.'”

    Hasn’t been since Charlottesville.

    Stop the nonsense.

  20. SocraticGadfly

    Longtime reader:

    Phil Collins is “in the air tonight” because his ex and her bf still have him locked out of that Miami mansion. (Google if you’ve not heard, or better, look on Twitter.)

    “Oh lawd.”

  21. Thomas Knapp

    Interesting predictions, Gadfly!

    I love it that people are going on the record. We’ll see how well everyone does.

    I predicted 48 states in 2012 and got all 48 right (I didn’t try to predict Florida or North Carolina — if I had, I’d have got Florida right and North Carolina wrong or vice versa, can’t remember).

    I predicted 50 states in 2016 and got 48 right (I missed Iowa and Wisconsin).

    I would really, really, really like to maintain a record of “at least 48 states correct.” 50 for 50 this time out would be even cooler.

    But … we’ll see. I’m more confident in my prediction this year than I was in 2016, but I could also be wildly wrong.

  22. SocraticGadfly

    William has Michigan as well as Pennsylvania leaning Trump??? Just by tweaking Michigan to likely Biden (it is) and Pennsylvania to lean Biden, that’s Biden’s election right there. Tweaking Michigan alone makes it an EV tie and means a Biden win of any other state that Saturn has any shade of pale red gives Biden the election.

  23. SocraticGadfly

    Thomas, I didn’t predict every state, as you see, in my blog. But, contra William, you can see where I’m at on states in more detail. (For the record, I expect Pennsylvania as well as Michigan to go Biden.) I also expect one or the other of Ohio and Florida to go Biden; either one puts him just ahead of Trump 2016 on EVs. Or, if NC goes Biden, that makes it a tie at 304. Pin me down and Biden takes Ohio and NC. Iowa and Georgia I have zero clue. Pin me down, and I’ll say Biden takes Iowa, Trump holds Georgia. (Sabato thinks the reverse, but I don’t see it.)

    IF Sabato is right on Georgia, two runoffs, or does one or the other of the Dems (Ossoff, most likely) win out one of the Senate seats tomorrow?

    On the state level, here, would be HUGE if Texas takes the state House. Not impossible by any means, as I note. Huge of course not only for power, especially against Patrick as Lite Guv, but redistricting. (As is, conservative Republicans, esp. in rural state House districts, will be EXTREMELY devouring each other over that.)

  24. SocraticGadfly

    For more background on my Texas Lege predictions and how they might affect redistricting, I blogged about the problem the Texas GOP will face, including the possibility of internecine fighting next year, a year ago, for any Texas readers here. (Thomas: I also note my puzzlement that the Texas LP, for all its growth, has yet to run a candidate in my state House district.) https://socraticgadfly.blogspot.com/2019/09/should-drew-springer-be-in-trouble-well.html

  25. Thane Eichenauer

    Trump with 538 electoral votes.
    I couriered in my early ballot to the county drop box today. Presuming that my signature on the envelope passes I will get an SMS acknowledgment that my ballot was counted.

  26. George Whitfield

    I estimate that Jo Jorgensen will receive 1.99% of the total popular vote for President and that her strongest state will be Alaska.

  27. Curt Boyd

    I rarely post anymore, but here goes:

    Who will win the election? – Joe Biden
    Are the polls accurate? – not if they don’t include all the candidates
    What will the Electoral College vote be? – 341-197
    What percentage of the vote will Jo Jorgensen receive? – 1 to 2%
    What will be Jorgensen’s strongest state? – Alaska
    What percentage of the vote will Howie Hawkins receive? – less than .5%
    What will be Hawkins’ strongest state? – New York
    How many write-in votes will Bernie Sanders receive? – much less than he did 4 years ago
    What third party or independent candidate will surprise? – Rocky De La Fuente
    What third party or independent candidate will disappoint? – Kanye West

    Happy voting!

  28. Root's Teeth Are Awesome

    No third party candidate will surprise. They are non-factors in this election.

    Jo will receive under 2% of the popular vote.

    I don’t know who will win. But I think Trump will score higher than the polls indicate. Many secret Trump voters out there, afraid to say so.

    The results will be contested, either way. And there will be much rioting and looting, regardless of the result.

  29. wolfefan

    Norpoth’s model has Pres. Trump winning NY, so I’m not going to put a lot of money on it.

  30. Jared

    Who will win the election?
    Biden, but not by much.

    Are the polls accurate?
    Not when they exclude third parties, and my gut says there are still a couple of points worth of shy Trump voters.

    What will the Electoral College vote be?
    295-243

    What percentage of the vote will Jo Jorgensen receive?
    Less than Gary Johnson and more than many Libertarians expect. I’ll say 2.5%.

    What will be Jorgensen’s strongest state?
    Alaska, Indiana, or Maine.

    What percentage of the vote will Howie Hawkins receive?
    0.5%

    What will be Hawkins’ strongest state?
    Vermont.

    How many write-in votes will Bernie Sanders receive?
    Not enough to concern establishment Dems.

    What third party or independent candidate will surprise?
    Brock Pierce? I dunno.

    What third party or independent candidate will disappoint?
    Hawkins will disappoint Greens who were hoping he would pick up a large share of the disaffected Bernie Bros vote.

  31. Krzysztof Lesiak

    Not presidential, but Arkansas’s Ricky Harrington has 33.8% of the vote with 50% of precincts reporting. If this holds, he’ll have the all-time LP U.S. Senate record, beating Joe Miller’s 29% in 2016. Harrington is currently leading in Pulaski County.

  32. Henrik Hansen

    Jo Joergensen is doing well, it will be the second best result for the party and the second best result result for a female presidential candidate in US history. well done

  33. SocraticGadfly

    Y’all know this COULD end in a 269-all tie. Writing at 10 pm Central. If, say Triump takes 4/5 Nebraska EVs and Biden 3/4 on Maine? From there, if Biden takes Michigan, Wisconsin, and Minnesota, all quite likely, and Nevada, fairly likely, and Arizona, somewhat likely?

    269.

    You can thank me for the nightmares or whatever.

  34. Jared

    SG: “Y’all know this COULD end in a 269-all tie.”

    In the event of a tie, it goes to the House for a contingent election. Congress hands it to Biden, and Trump supporters lose their minds. If Biden wins AZ, NV, MI, WI, and 3/4 ME, and Trump wins GA, NC, PA, and 1/4 ME, then it will be 270-268. I think that’s more likely than an electoral college tie.

  35. Thomas Knapp

    So far, I am 44-45 of states called.

    Unfortunately, the one state I blew was Florida.

    And, of course, the remaining states except for Alaska are “battleground” states that will decide the outcome.

    I’m going to be way off on my electoral college prediction (Biden 319, Trump 219).

    At the moment, though, I think Biden is going to win it.

    There are 35,000 outstanding mail ballots in Erie County, Pennsylvania. If they track the already counted mail ballots, they’ll go 5-to-1 for Biden, giving him a win not as big as Obama’s in 2012, but far better than Clinton’s loss of that county in 2016. And if that ratio holds across the state, Trump’s done there.

    I haven’t dug into what’s left in Michigan and Wisconsin, but it seems unlikely that Trump can carry either of those, either.

  36. Be Rational

    Socratic … you missed by one EV.

    It looks like Biden WILL win NV, AZ, WI, MI, and MN along with 3/4 in Maine and 1/5 in NE … This will give him exactly 270, not 269.

    If Trump wins all 5 in Nebraska in the above, it would be a 269 tie. Not likely.
    If Biden wins all 4 in ME, he would have 271.

    A Biden win in PA … still possible … would make all this moot.

  37. Ryan

    Think it’s time to write another epitaph for the funeral of the polling industry.

    In Indiana Governor, Libertarian Donald Rainwater has finished 2nd ahead of Democrat Woody Myers in 32 of the state’s 92 counties. Percentage-wise the results are 58-30-12 with Republican incumbent Eric Holcomb winning. We have straight ticket voting in Indiana, so I’m going to see what results look like for people that actually picked their governor selection because Libertarians are at a severe disadvantage there.

  38. Ryan

    “In the event of a tie, it goes to the House for a contingent election. Congress hands it to Biden, and Trump supporters lose their minds.”

    Not necessarily. In a contingent election, the house delegations of each state vote as a unit. So California’s Representatives get 1 vote, Wyoming’s Representative gets 1 vote.

  39. William Saturn Post author

    In the event of an electoral tie, the Republican candidate will most likely win.

    Of the races called, I have been 100 percent in my prediction, except for NE-2. That may change with MI however.

  40. Thomas Knapp

    The margin of error on polls is usually 3-4%, and it’s presumably larger on national polls on an irrelevant metric in a country of 300 million.

    I’m talking about actual polls in actual states. Can you name a single poll in, say, Michigan, in which the outcome is outside the margin of error? If you can, feel free to do so. And if the deviation is in Trump’s favor vis a vis actual outcome, then perhaps there will be grounds for “shy Trump voter” talk.

  41. Thomas Knapp

    Thanks — I’ll have a look at those polls. They’re separated from the actual election by a few days in time, but I’d say that they were close enough to not suffer much from changes of mind, and presumably do reflect a fair test of the polling methodology.

    My guess is not that “shy Trump voters” were underpolled, but that in the “likely voter” population surveyed, Trump voters were more likely than Biden voters to actually vote.

  42. Ryan

    There was a late Washington Post/ABC poll (think done by Langer) that had Biden leading Trump in Wisconsin 57-40. Compared to actual results, that’s unforgivable.

    Change Research had a poll for Indiana Governor from I think September that was Republican incumbent 36, hapless Democrat 30, Libertarian 24. End result was Republican incumbent 58, hapless Democrat 30, Libertarian 12. I should state that while the poll was completely bogus snd everyone when it came out thought it was, it did give the Libertarian nominee a much higher profile in the race than he otherwise would have, and he finished in 2nd place ahead of the Democrat in a third of the state’s counties.

  43. George Phillies

    “The margin of error on polls is usually 3-4%, and it’s presumably larger on national polls on an irrelevant metric in a country of 300 million.”

    The margin of error is typically smaller in national polls, because they typically have a larger sample size.

  44. Be Rational

    Turnout.
    GOTV – Get Out The Vote

    The polling can be exactly correct, but if one party is significantly better at delivering its supporters to the polls, or in turning intentions into voting by mail, then the actual outcome in votes will not match the polls. This doesn’t make the polling wrong. It makes the expectations of the people reading the polls wrong. There are many kinds of activities and strategies that can increase the turnout for one side and depress, discourage or suppress the turnout for the other side. Political polling measures intentions or feelings but cannot predict actions taken based on those intentions or feelings.

    A poll may show candidate C1 leading in the polls with 55% support and C2 with 45% vote. But the C2 campaign gets 80% of its supporters to actually vote while C1 gets only 60% of its supporters to vote.

    Meaning candidate C2 would win with 52% and C1 would lose at 48%.

    But, a survey after the election could still show C1 to C2 at 55% to 45%.

    Polling does not guarantee the effectiveness of GOTV efforts.
    We should expect state results to differ from polling, even when the polling is completely accurate.

  45. SocraticGadfly

    NOPE, Wiliam.

    Still wrong.

    Electoral post-mortems, to also rope in Thomas and polls issues, say that it was …

    “Fuck you Trump voters,” NOT “shy Trump voters.”

    Especially in areas with, as best as can be told, high QAnon interest, many Trump voters didn’t trust pollsters and refused to answer. Or, in some cases, it’s believed they may have given deliberately false answers. Nothing shy about that. https://www.nbnews24.com/2020/11/07/study-considers-a-link-between-qanon-and-polling-errors/

    Elsewhere, a place like National Review called people like that “shy” voters. I wouldn’t.

    The only possible exception might be shy **minority** Trump voters, as with Hispanics in the Valley here in Texas.

  46. SocraticGadfly

    Looks like I may have nailed it on EVs!

    I said I thought Biden had a 50-50 shot to catch Trump’s 2016 total. Well, assuming AP’s call on Arizona was right, and he’s now got Pennsylvania?

    If he wins Georgia, that’s 306. Just a shade ahead of Trump.

  47. Be Rational

    Actually, in 2016 the Electoral Vote as called in the election was 306 to 232 … exactly what will come if Biden holds AZ and GA and Trump holds NC. However, 2 Trump electors and 5 Clinton electors were disillusioned enough with both candidates to cast their ballots for others including 3 for Colin Powell and 1 for Ron Paul.

  48. SocraticGadfly

    Be Rational, I was going by the actual vote.

    Oh, SCOTUS decided the case this summer wrongly, arguably. That said, the Founders didn’t anticipate political parties. More the case, actually, they hoped they wouldn’t come here; they actually knew of “groupings” like the king’s party and the country party in Britain, which were partially mirrored in the colonies.

    This is yet another reason to treat the Constutution, and claims of his high insights, exactly as fundamentalists’ claims about the “Authorized Version” should be treated.

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