Green Party: Abortion Rights are Human Rights!


Mobile Bay, Alabama – A woman’s right to bodily autonomy is not to be trifled with. These regressive laws being passed by our out of touch state government to restrict women’s rights will not go by without hearing our voices!

Sexism and women’s oppression are blights on our society that go deep. We are seeing them institutionalized in front of our very eyes. We show that SOLIDARITY is stronger than their repressive attacks on women! Women are not second class citizens!

Rally hosted by the Mobile Bay Green Party
Bienville Square, 150 Dauphin Street, Mobile, Alabama
Sunday, May 19
Noon – 3 p.m. CDT

We must demand the right to reproductive healthcare, including abortion, as well as the right to have a child without the burden of enormous childcare costs – this means demanding free, universal childcare.

Our movements can’t wait for the Democratic Party or the mainstream women’s organizations to become the leadership we need. Defeating backwards anti-choice legislation will require a determined struggle from below. Beyond defensive battles, we must organize for an end to for-profit healthcare, and for a Medicare for All system including free, legal, and accessible abortion. We can fight to win a federal $15 minimum wage and high-quality social housing, which is the bare minimum necessary for working class families!

There will be speakers and a march through downtown.

Stand with us all, Sunday! If you can’t make it, STAY TUNED! This isn’t the end.

Bring your best protest signs and your friends!

RSVP

35 thoughts on “Green Party: Abortion Rights are Human Rights!

  1. Seebeck

    And this is why the Greens are a bunch of clueless dipshits.

    No woman, no PERSON, has any right to kill an innocent child, regardless of age. Period. Full Stop.

    The relationship between the in-utero child and the mother is symbiotic, not parasitic. This has been known for years courtesy of stem cell research. See https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2633676/

    One cannot claim self-defense against the child because the child is not committing aggression. Nor is the child responsible for the actions of its parents, and it is not subject to punishment of death for them.

    Medical science has made abortion pretty much obsolete. Ectopic transplants have been done since 1915. That’s right, over a century. See http://epublications.marquette.edu/lnq/vol62/iss1/9. In-utero surgery now corrects most birth defects.

    The reality is that pregnancy is a consequence, planned or not, of sex. That consequence carries the responsibility at a minimum to carry that child until such point of viability outside the womb. At such point, adoption can be an option. But abortion is the abdication of that responsibility, in the worst way, by killing the innocent and helpless child.

    It really is that simple.

    If you advocate killing of innocent children, then you’re simply subhuman scum.

    So says this father of two wanted and loved sons, who had one of them taken from him in stillbirth/natural abortion without my or my wife’s consent.

  2. Don J Grundmann

    HenryMakow.com – ” Green Movements are Illuminati Psyops.” The Plantation Masters/bankers fund the Green Party and other Death Religion front groups to promote the destruction of the nation and the enslavement of the citizens. In regard to abortion they have Socially Engineered countless drones, such as Fernando, to repeat the Death Religion anti-science gospel that a child is NOT a child but something less than human; i.e.; they ” niggerize ” the child which then makes killing it acceptable ( at least to them ). They can then support mass genocide ( see BlackGenocide.org ) without the slightest peep from their pesky ( but now long dead and strangled ) conscience; the message from God/The Creator that tells them they must repent from their love of evil.

    Don J. Grundmann, D.C.
    Chairman of the California Constitution Party; the last party in California which will oppose the atheists, humanists, and Satanists in their love of the mutilation/shredding of unborn children inclusive of infanticide.

  3. dL

    The relationship between the in-utero child and the mother is symbiotic, not parasitic. This has been known for years courtesy of stem cell research.

    You need to make up your mind regarding the supposed scientific facts. This is what you wrote back in 2009.
    https://independentpoliticalreport.com/2009/07/tad-britch-the-libertarian-case-for-life/#comment-77644

    You can’t end a human life if it hasn’t started yet, can you? Just because a group of cells called a fetus forms a certain way doesn’t make it a human any more than a collection of auto parts formed a certain way becomes a car. The fact that you claim it does flies in the face of anything resembling life science and biology.

    Typical for your pompous bloviations, you’re wrong both times.

  4. Don J Grundmann

    dL – Regarding your ” bloviation ” – Life science and biology recognize that a human life begins at fertilization. Period and end of story. Any other claim is not ” life ” science and biology but ” death ” science and anti-biology; i.e.; a humanistic/satanic religious replacement of true & actual science which provides a political cover to sanitize killing humans at ANY age.

  5. Fernando Mercado

    So Don; since you’re obviously a huge science guy you’d also agree with the science showing Climate Change is a serious issue that must be dealt with with, Homosexuality is completely natural and should be accepted, vaccines are completely safe, and a fetus isn’t considered a Baby until around 24 Weeks.

    Considering you don’t believe in any of the things I just stated, can you please stop pretending you care about Science?

  6. C. Al Currier

    Regardless of your views about abortion, the biggest single complaint I’ve always heard from science-oriented participants in the Green Party is this:
    The Green Party is more pink than green!

  7. dL

    Life science and biology recognize that a human life begins at fertilization.

    Given that 3/4 of all fertilized eggs don’t successfully implant in the uterus, I would say not. Not in the way you are trying to stretch a trivially obvious fact into a moral premise.

    a humanistic/satanic religious replacement

    I would counter by flatly stating the moral degenerates are those who would turn human reproduction into a mass criminal conspiracy in order to gain some political advantage.

  8. Don J Grundmann

    Fernando – Time limitations will hamper fully addressing the giant pile of horse manure which comprises your post but to begin – With a $1,000 bet I challenge you or anyone you choose to represent you to a public debate on the fraud/lie/hoax of the Religion ( not science ) of so-called ” Climate Change ” ( or whatever other advertising slogan is being used at that time ). In short, the Religion of Climate Change is a multi-billion dollar Social Engineering project designed to permanently impoverish and enslave humanity while providing ever more riches for the Plantation Masters who rule us; with a few peanuts thrown to Plantation Master lackeys/chumps like yourself who help the PM’s in their attack upon humanity. Prediction – Neither you nor any other fanatic/lunatic supporter of the CC madness will accept as you know you will be totally annihilated in any such open debate. I will address your other insanities later.

  9. Jared

    dL: “Given that 3/4 of all fertilized eggs don’t successfully implant in the uterus, I would say not. Not in the way you are trying to stretch a trivially obvious fact into a moral premise.”

    I’ve heard it’s somewhere between half and two-thirds. Still, while a successful implantation marks the beginning of pregnancy, fertilization marks the beginning of new human life. Do mortality rates due to natural causes render non-natural killings more permissible? If frequent implantation failure, miscarriage (pre-20 weeks), or stillbirth (post-20 weeks) proves that non-spontaneous abortion is no big deal, then a spike in the SIDS death rate could potentially justify infanticide.

    I’d rather focus on matters of prenatal personhood and property rights than whether an embryo/fetus is biologically alive, but I suspect pro-life activists tend to harp on it because it’s an easy win, and so many pro-choice activists strongly deny even the (morally trivial) fact that a fertilized embyro is a living organism, all the while claiming science is on their side. In this case, it isn’t. Maybe they think no premise should ever be conceded to pro-lifers, no matter how basic or insignificant; maybe they feel their case collapses if abortion really constitutes the taking of a human life, so the premise is inadmissible. Either way, they aren’t doing themselves any favors.

  10. Jared

    Fernando: “Not a child. It’s a Zygote”

    “Child” and “baby” are non-technical terms whose definitions derive from common usage. “Zygote” is a technical term denoting the earliest stage of human development, as “neonate” refers to a newborn infant.

    Pro-lifers may gravitate to ordinary language which they do consider applicable and which normally inspires moral feeling and protective or nurturing attitudes, but they don’t reject medical labels. It really isn’t fair when pro-choicers demand that people strictly use cold, clinical semantics–outside an academic context–as a cheap way to score rhetorical points by dehumanizing the object of abortion.

    https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/child

  11. Jared

    CAC: “The Green Party is more pink than green!”

    Agreed. I’m a Georgist libertarian with a strong green streak. The Green Party would be a lot more appealing to me if they cared nearly as much about actual environmental issues such as land rights, industrial pollution, natural resource depletion and sustainability, urban sprawl, etc., as they do about militant feminism, queer liberation, and preserving Third World socialist autocracy. Sometimes I can’t help wondering whether Greens view climate change more negatively as an ecological threat or positively as a shining opportunity to bind markets and empower international government.

  12. dL

    fertilization marks the beginning of new human life. Do mortality rates due to natural causes render non-natural killings more permissible?

    Fertilization marks the beginning of a new life that more than likely quickly terminates in a spontaneous abortion washed out in the menstrual cycle. That’s the biological fact. Try as you may, you can’t turn “life begins at conception” into a moral premise unless you’re trying to establishing a conclusion that (1) everyone should be put in jail or (2) voluntary human extinction(humans thus shouldn’t reproduce). Trying to analogize the female prerogative vis a vis the high abortion cost of reproduction with a “everyone dies, hence murder is justifiable” logical fallacy is patently absurd.

    Life begins at conception–as a trivial biological fact–carries no enforceable moral weight. An embryo is not a person. A (late term) fetus may or may not be a person, but termination falls under the right of self-defense. There is no libertarian argument AT ALL for parental obligation for an unwanted pregnancy(beyond the mere obligation to give birth). The “personal responsibility” claptrap actually falls on those who would force unwanted pregnancies to be carried to term to pay the welfare costs of the state run orphanages if the pro-lifers succeed in recreating Ceausescu’s Romania abortion prohibition regime.

  13. Don J Grundmann

    Fernando – As a continuance of addressing your fecal pile post – ” Homosexuality is completely natural and should be accepted ” is true in the same sense that cancer is ” natural ” and we can resignedly ” accept ” it just because it is so common; although commonality does not change it from the pathology which it is just as ” acceptance ” does not change homosexuality from the soul pathology which it is. Both are sicknesses; one of the body and one of the soul although I, and countless other rational, normal, natural, and healthy people completely reject the ” acceptance ” of homosexuality for many reasons inclusive of the goal of its afflicted practitioners ( and especially the Plantation Master controllers of their Movement ) to spread their soul cancer to children; i.e.; to legalize pedophilia which is the ultimate goal of the PM’s and their tool of the Homosexual/Sodomy Movement. I could explain this much more but as a condensed Bottom Line – There is no such thing as a homosexual MAN; only a homosexual MALE; i.e.; an inferior, defective, less than a man substitute ( also known as a ” wimp ” ). An automatic correlary is that there is no such thing as a man who supports homosexualuty; i.e.; a man who supports a sickness/pathology within other man. ONLY a MALE; i.e.; an inferior/less than man will support pathology/sickness in other males ( since a REAL man will never be a homosexual; i.e.; a sodomite ( the true name for a male homosexual ). A man will NEVER support or endorse a male being afflicted by a soul pathology inclusive of homosexuality. And the ultimate answer for you is that – Yes, it is possible for you to someday be a man when you B) reverse your sick support of homosexuality by first A) repented of hating/resenting your father; the action which was the catalyst in breaking your soul and changing you from a potential man to an outright male.

    You are welcome.

    Don J. Grundmann, D.C.
    Chairman, Constitution Party of California; the last party in the state fighting to defend true masculinity and stop the collapse of men

  14. Fernando Mercado

    Wow, I’ve seen idiotic conservative Christians on the internet but never had one try to lecture me with their archaic ideology. I’m not debating Climate Change or Gay People because THERE IS NO TWO SIDES TO THE ISSUE.

    You’re getting to levels of talking out of your ass that I’ve never seen before. Plantation Masters, sicknesses, Gay men aren’t men, and other BS points that you pulled out of your ass.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_gay_men_in_the_United_States#Notable_American_gay_men

  15. dL

    There is no such thing as a homosexual MAN; only a homosexual MALE; i.e.; an inferior, defective, less than a man substitute ( also known as a ” wimp ” ).

    Well, you do pass the eye test regarding being an authority on wimp credentials

  16. LibertyDave

    One right does not trump another. Your right to life does not give you the right to control another person’s body. A person who needs something from somebody else to live doesn’t have the right to just force that person to give them what they need. Just like a person with kidney failure doesn’t have the right to force somebody else to give them one of theirs, you don’t have the right to force a woman to give birth.

    Either you have a right to control your own body or you are nothing more than a slave. Those who claim to be pro-life are pro-slavery of all women for the sake of the children.

    I will not be enslaved by anyone, nor will I enslave anyone else. This is what liberty is about. It is sad to see people who claim to be libertarians, but don’t understand this simple concept.

  17. Jared

    dL: “Fertilization marks the beginning of a new life that more than likely quickly terminates in a spontaneous abortion washed out in the menstrual cycle. That’s the biological fact.”

    Which as far as I know I’d not disputed, except by those pro-choicers who deny it is new human life.

    “Try as you may, you can’t turn ‘life begins at conception’ into a moral premise”

    I believe I called it morally trivial. All human life deserves respect, but because I don’t believe personhood emerges at conception, I’m not prepared to say, for example, that taking an abortifacient such as RU-486 constitutes an act of murder.

    “Trying to analogize the female prerogative vis a vis the high abortion cost of reproduction with a ‘everyone dies, hence murder is justifiable’ logical fallacy is patently absurd.”

    You had said, replying to Don’s prior comment that new human life begins at fertilization:

    “Given that 3/4 of all fertilized eggs don’t successfully implant in the uterus, I would say not. Not in the way you are trying to stretch a trivially obvious fact into a moral premise.”

    Well, he was simply stating a fact, which you (unlike many abortion enthusiasts) acknowledge to be a fact, even if it doesn’t in itself answer any ethical questions. My point is that implantation failure rates are also morally irrelevant. Citing them as evidence that a human embryo is not meaningfully alive, is not a person, has no intrinsic moral value, etc., even if your conclusion is ultimately correct, has some farther-reaching ethical implications that most pro-choicers would be unwilling to entertain. And yes, both arguments flirt with the naturalistic fallacy.

    “A (late term) fetus may or may not be a person, but termination falls under the right of self-defense.”

    I can’t agree that second and third-trimesters abortions, irrespective of circumstance, are necessarily self-defensive acts of justifiable homicide. Even if it were true that the fetus is guilty of trespass the moment he or she becomes unwanted (which I don’t accept, but I’ll go along with it for the sake of argument), most libertarians would agree the trespasser owns his own body even if he does not own the womb. Therefore, if the offended property owner can safely evict the unwelcome guest without killing or causing him harm, then she has an obligation to do so.

    “There is no libertarian argument AT ALL for parental obligation for an unwanted pregnancy(beyond the mere obligation to give birth).”

    On a hard right-libertarian, absolutist theory of property rights, probably not.

    “The ‘personal responsibility’ claptrap actually falls on those who would force unwanted pregnancies to be carried to term to pay the welfare costs of the state run orphanages if the pro-lifers succeed in recreating Ceausescu’s Romania abortion prohibition regime.”

    I’d imagine American pro-lifers would be over the moon if the U.S. would only adopt *current* Romanian abortion law, which permits elective abortions only through the 14th week. OTC contraception and reforming and streamlining the adoption process should be as important to the pro-life cause as passing State legislation or overturning Roe v. Wade.

  18. Don J Grundmann

    ” Those who claim to be pro-life are pro-slavery for all women.” A truly classic statement illustrating how depraved, satanic, humanistic, and just plain soul dead our society, culture, and nation ( and the author of that statement ) has become. Where a Christian ethic celebrates the birth of a child as a wondrous gift from God the anti-humans consider children as parasites and equate carrying a child to slavery!!!! Truly amazing but what else could you ever expect from demons? Of course those same people don’t give a damn!!!! about the heartbreak which females have when they realize they have killed their own child; an act inherently against their deepest inner nature which would NATURALLY truly love a child – until they were soul poisoned by the ” slavery ” idea/sickness and other farts from hell which claim to give them ” freedom ” from the ” tyranny ” of childbirth and motherhood. All part of the massive Social Engineering program to change women into females ( and men into males who fart these farts ) by having them kill their own children while proclaiming ” pro-choice ” – an idea which does not exist in reality as females are continuously denied true choice ( the facts of both sides ) in order to exploit them at an emotional moment so that they are tricked into the fateful soul death ( theirs ) decision to kill their own child to obtain ” freedom;” a ” freedom ” which becomes their permanent soul slavery, pain, and regret. Of course those demons who proclaim their ” liberty ” in killing their child will NEVER FOR A SECOND help them through their private, and continuous, anguish, pain, and regret regarding the death of their child much less even acknowledge its occurance. No, these aspiring demons will never even acknowledge that a female has a soul. ONLY pro-lifers will recognize, acknowledge, promote, protect, and cherish the humanity of women and females. In complete contrast pro-deathers who proclaim that ” liberty ” and ” freedom ” are found by shredding and mutilating children will throw the unfortunate female who heeds their demonic song right into the trash. No, LibertyDave, women and females are far far far more than the mechanical bodies which your Religion of Evolution claims them to be. It is truly a tragedy that your so well parrotted ( for that is what you are ) demonic line will fool countless females into their own soul suicide. As compensation for your efforts you will have a good eternity to spend in Hell reflecting on your treachery and betrayal of the female half of humanity.

    Don J. Grundmann , D.C.
    Chairman, Constitution Party of Calfornia; the last political party challenging males to become real and true men by protecting women and females from the complete lie of abortion.

  19. Don J Grundmann

    Fernando – Yet another easy prediction come true as the English Translation of your post = We are wayyyyyyy too cowardly to ever dream of trying to defend our undefensible fantasy that ” the sky is falling;” i.e.; global warming. We know that we would be slaughtered in any true debate.

    Don J. Grundmann, D.C.
    Chairman, Constitution Party of California; the last party which believes in REAL science, opposes fake ( ” the sky is falling ” ) science, and the ONLY party which will debate ( and not cower in fear ) any and all opponents on any issue. In other words, the ONLY party which will both tell and defend the truth.

  20. Don J Grundmann

    A) ” Climate-Gate ” by Brian Sussman and ” The Politically Incorrect Guide to Global Warming ” by Marc Morano are 2 books ( among countless ) which totally annihilate your ” the sky is falling!!! ” fantasy but additionally completely expose the total lie/fraud/hoax of your NASA so-called ” facts ” website; a totally laughable ” resource ” which can be easily debunked in 5 seconds at the most.

    B) Regarding what you refer to as ” the Sky Daddy ” how, ” Mr. Science,” did ONE, JUST ONE, cell ( inclusive of cell membrane, nucleus, DNA, and THE ABILITY TO SELF-REPLICATE/REPAIR, ” evolve???.”

    Answer – The evolution of even ONE cell, much less an entire body is absolutely impossible. Therefore both you, I, and the entire world and universe were created by God.

    Very simple to understand – except for those who despise God and give their love, allegiance, loyalty, and devotion to His enemy, also known as Satan/Lucifer; an action performed not simply with individuals but with entire political parties such as the Democrats, Greens, and Libertarians who all subscribe to the motto – ” Better to be a king in Hell than a servant in Heaven.”

  21. Don J Grundmann

    Fernando – As a final fumigant to your initial dung pile – ” Vaccines are completely safe.” Of course, and that is why there is a government fund which has paid out hundreds of millions of dollars for vaccine damage claims.

    My psychic powers tell me that you were educated in public schools. How else to explain why you are such an obedient parrot regarding the Social Engineering lies which the Plantation Masters teach their drones to repeat?

    And speaking of repeated lies – there is not only no such thing as a ” gay man ” ( as no REAL man could ever be ” gay;” i.e.; a sodomite; but there is no such thing as ” gay.” It is simply an advertising/public relations/Social Engineering/marketing phrase to substitute for the REAL word – sodomite. Hence no such thing as ” gay ” only ” sodomite.”

    You are welcome.

    Don J. Grundmann, D.C.
    Chairman, Constitution Party of California; the last political party promoting and celebrating men and REAL masculinity ( + women and femininity ) as compared to wimps and ” girly men.” The last political party supporting ” normal, natural, and healthy ” REAL human beings.

  22. Don J Grundmann

    As yet another demonstration of your brainlessness you cannot/will not respond to the basic question but instead revert to your nitwit ” Santa Claus ” comment.

    The question is designed to show how your most basic belief structure is based on sand. Rather than accept both new information and, especially, the faultiness/error of your previous programming you choose the default action for egomaniacs who willingly wish to remain stupid – you make a stupid/nitwit comment to avoid the reality that your programming has made you quite dumb; i.e.; you could choose to learn and develop but you instead willingly remain stupid. Too bad for you. You are simply training yourself to forever be an obedient drone; the common descriptive term for which is ” beta ” although I will bet that you are so well trained in your droneness that you are actually an ” omega,” i.e.; a male who has no clue of even what a ” beta ” is. Too bad. The mass manufacturing of males via Social Engineering has been so fantastically successful that countless males ( inferior men ) have no clue of a clue how they have been swindled and tricked out of and away from their very essense. Your commentaries simply well illustrate that you are simply yet another mutated blade of grass cut down by the lawnmower of Social Engineering.

    Don J. Grundmann, D.C.
    Chairman, Constitution Party of California; the last political party working to both preserve REAL men and masculinity but to cultivate both.

  23. dL

    As yet another demonstration of your brainlessness you cannot/will not respond to the basic question but instead revert to your nitwit ” Santa Claus ” comment.

    There is no questions be poised. It’s just a steady stream of some bad Westboro Baptist Church knockoff comedy. One might get the impression you’re projecting something about your own masculinity.

  24. Krzysztof Lesiak

    Fernando Mercado – “I’m not gonna debate some random Far-Right failed political candidate because THERE IS NO DEBATE, the facts are all there but YOU CHOOSE NOT TO LISTEN TO THEM!!!!”

    “Neo-fascists” have just taken over Italy, so this debate may not be worth having with members of a political party with 0,1-0,15% popular support, but it appears to be you left-wingers in Italy cannot discredit the far-right because you are going to lose if you do no know how to win the rural areas and Catholics who will never support movements with progressive views on social issues. Marine Le Pen wins big, Marian Kotleba’s nationalist party in Slovakia got a record high 12%, also 11% for Germany AfD and Farage runs away with 31%, etc. Europe will start shifting more toward the “far-right” after Trump’s reelection in 2020.

    Italy Eu Parliament election May 26th, 2019:

    League (Lega) MENF Matteo Salvini 9,175,108 34.26
    29 / 73
    Democratic Party (PD) PES Carlo Calenda 6,089,017 22.74
    19 / 73
    Five Star Movement (M5S) None Dino Giarrusso 4,569,020 17.06
    14 / 73
    Forza Italia (FI) EPP Silvio Berlusconi 2,351,606 8.78
    7 / 73
    Brothers of Italy (FdI) ECR Giorgia Meloni 1,726,162 6.45
    6 / 73
    More Europe (+EU) ALDE Emma Bonino 833,202 3.11
    0 / 73
    Green Europe (EV) Greens Giuseppe Civati 621,356 2.32
    0 / 73
    The Left (SIN) PEL Eleonora Forenza 469,884 1.75
    0 / 73
    Communist Party (PC) INITIATIVE Marco Rizzo 235,535 0.88 new
    0 / 73
    new

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_European_Parliament_election_in_Italy

  25. Seebeck

    Well, ya know something, dL?

    People learn new information and change their views because of it.

    What I wrote in 2009 is no longer relevant, and the study I cited happened two years later.

    Knowledge improved, and views changed because of it.

    Sorry that you have this absurd notion that once someone says something, if their view changes they’re suddenly a hypocrite. The real world doesn’t function that way.

    So what, from that post of a decade ago, changed?

    Only this single statement:

    In fact, conception does not begin the human life in the slightest, because there are still steps that are necessary before fetal development can begin (cell division, forming the zygote, implantation onto the uterine wall, and the miosis to form the placenta, just to name a few that can fail and void your guarantee), as any junior-high biology student can tell you.

    The reality is that conception does begin a human life, and the steps listed above necessary for fetal development to begin are in fact part of the gestational process of that human life, which extends long past the exiting of the uterus into the world, all the way to full adult maturation.

    In other words, the gestation process, is far more than simple pregnancy.

    However, the gestational process, just like assembling a car in a garage, is essential in order for that human life to be viable and functional separate from the mother, aka viability. That gestational process is part of human life and human being growth.

    Plus, you neglected this:

    The difference is that the libertarian philosophy draws the line in those surroundings based on denial of those rights to other individuals by force as being wrong, and allowing or defending those rights to other individuals by force as right. In other words, defending self or others by force is OK, but oppressing them is not.

    Abortion denies the right to life to a child by force. That’s aggression and the ultimate in oppression, and that simply is not a libertarian position to take. Hiding behind the state’s definition of birth doesn’t rebut it, and science shows the “tumor” or “collection of cells” arguments are false as well. The “initiation of force against the mother” argument also fails because of the symbiosis cited in the 2011 study.

    So bottom line? You’re complaining about me gaining knowledge and changing my opinion based on that new knowledge, and as such, you make yourself out to be the fool. Again.

    I hope you never experience holding your dead child in your arms. Been there, done that. He wasn’t a clump of cells. HE WAS MY SON.

    And ALL children of pregnancies are CHILDREN, not clumps of cells. Period. Full Stop.

    Be thankful that your parents felt the same way.,

  26. Seebeck

    LibertyDave spewed:

    Either you have a right to control your own body or you are nothing more than a slave. Those who claim to be pro-life are pro-slavery of all women for the sake of the children.

    Wrong. No mother has any right to commit aggression on an innocent child, regardless of age. That includes abuse and death, and it includes both prenatal and postnatal.

    If you justify killing an innocent child as some sort of absurd argument of self-defense against slavery, then you have no clue about slavery and should go about paying your price for a civilized society, then go take a biology class and learn the reproductive process that you obviously flunked in junior high school, change you moniker to “KillingChildrenDave”, and don’t breed, because you clearly lack the knowledge and maturity to understand what being responsible for one’s actions means, especially in the creation of a new human life.

    One cannot justify killing an innocent child because of the actions of either parent, the irresponsibility of refusing to accept the consequences of their actions, convenience of the mother, or any other argument that denies respect for others, denies the NAP, denies human dignity, or promotes unnecessary and senseless killing.

    Don’t like that? Tough shit.

  27. Seebeck

    dL,

    You’re not anywhere near intelligent or smart enough to mock anyone or anything, and if you were, mocking a parent of a dead child only shows you to be a despicable POS that deserves to be exiled to a desert island directly in the path of a Category 5 hurricane, with Karma determining your fate.

    Now do us all a favor and go self-fornicate somewhere else–preferably back in the third-grade special ed class that you keep failing.

  28. dL

    You’re not anywhere near intelligent or smart enough to mock anyone or anything, and if you were, mocking a parent of a dead child only shows you to be a despicable POS that deserves to be exiled to a desert island directly in the path of a Category 5 hurricane, with Karma determining your fate.

    I was mocking your propensity to present your crackpot rationalizations as scientific certitude, which your little temper tantrum–which clearly reveals the real reason you switched–only confirmed. And I would proffer you have a bit too high opinion of the regard the gods would have for righting the message board injustices against Michael Seebeck.

  29. Don J Grundmann

    Seebeck – I can feel your sorrow/anguish regarding your son through your writing. Certainly those who oppose/scorn/ridicule you on this forum have no capability for the slightest understanding of your commentaries as they are polarized in their soul to their anti-life religious belief despite whatever sanitizing cover story ( defending ” womens rights ” ) they may use. If you google ” Bertrand Russell black snow comment ” you will see that our anti-life opponents are the culmination of the process which Russell refers to. They are totally incapable of breaking away from their religious indoctrination and will in fact proclaim that they are ” independent thinkers!!!!” as they repeat the mantras and 1,000% + support the policies of The Plantation Masters; i.e.; pro-death, ” climate change,” sodomy and everything else designed to destroy our culture, society, and nation. May our Creator comfort you in your loss.

    Don J. Grundmann, D.C.
    Chairman, Constitution Party of California; the last party working to preserve the Christian foundations of our nation against the Satanist/Humanist religion which works to replace them with their opposites.

  30. LibertyDave

    Seebeck shows himself to be another disgruntled republican that doesn’t give a damn about what happens to other people. Just like most republicans and democrats he believes that the only solution to any problem is to use the force of government to enslave other people instead of trying to help them.

    Seebeck, you can call me all the names you want but it’s people like you who pretend to care when it obvious you don’t, then call for the use of government to control the people you don’t agree with that are the real monsters.

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