Alan Keyes Says Obama’s Long Form Birth Certificate is a Fake

Today I received the following e-mail from one time candidate for the Constitution Party Presidential nomination Alan Keyes. Here is a taste:

Alert: Proof Positive has uncovered indisputable evidence that the “long form birth certificate” produced by Barack Obama is a forgery!

There is a reason forgers always get caught; paper trails are nearly impossible to erase. So, rather than coming clean with a real long form birth certificate, Obama continues his cover up that will make Nixon’s Watergate look like a boy getting caught with his hand in the cookie jar. All we need to do is compare Obama’s forgery with a real Hawaiian long form birth certificate to see it is a fake and another cover up – JUST AS TEAM OBAMA AND THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE (DNC) DID IN THE 2008 ELECTION.

Susan E. Nordyke was born in Hawaii the day after Barack Obama’s reported birthday. In fact, she was born at the same hospital where Obama claims to have been born. And Nordyke has released her official long form birth certificate – which proves Obama’s newly released document is a complete forgery.

*Picture in Original*

The discrepancies between these two documents are numerous, but the most glaringly obvious proof of forgery is the file and certificate number on the upper right side of each document.

Allow me to explain. In every county of this nation, there is a County Clerk or Registrar whose job is to document births, deaths, marriages and other official papers for archival purposes. This documentation is given a certificate number and entered into record books. The certificate numbers are issued in sequential order based on the date the Clerk or Registrar received the official document. The later a record is registered by the county clerk, the higher the certificate number.

Ms. Nordyke’s birth certificate was registered August 11, 1961 and has a certificate # of 61-10637.

Barack Obama’s newly released birth certificate is registered August 8, 1961 and has a certificate # of 61-10641.

See the problem? Obama was supposedly registered 3 days before Nordyke, yet Obama’s certificate lists a number 3 digits after Nordyke’s.

This is impossible.

If Obama’s document were legitimate, it would necessarily have a certificate number before Nordyke’s.

We can thank Donald Trump for forcing Obama to play an ill-considered hand AND criminally revealing hand. Now it is imperative we ensure that Trump, the state legislatures, and others finally looking at this crisis hear from us about all the evidence of wrong-doing and collusion that continue to unfold.

We must demand our state legislators require proof positive evidence of eligibility for any candidate seeking the highest office in our land, or Barack Hussein Obama may well steal the election once again.

See more here…

Note: The e-mail is long and like a lot of promotional e-mails contains pictures and text that don’t translate well here, so I excerpted the begining and then provided a link to the e-mail in web page form.

70 thoughts on “Alan Keyes Says Obama’s Long Form Birth Certificate is a Fake

  1. Former Vital Statistics Employee

    Big hospitals don’t send each form in sequentially by date; they batch them up and send a number at a time. Vital Statistics personnel don’t sort them sequentially by date either; no one but Ambassador Keyes ever cared before about the date sequence matching the key sequence.

  2. George Phillies

    In the immortal works of Fergus Cullen writing on Redhampshire.com (the entire article is surely worth reading) “A Public Policy Polling survey found that 48 percent of Iowa Republicans don’t believe President Obama was born in the United States, and another 26 percent said they weren’t sure if he was or if he wasn’t. It’s hard to talk about real issues when three quarters of the audience wears tin foil hats.”

  3. sunshinebatman

    Barry released his image two days after Hawaii announced they will never certify a long-form birth certificate. Good luck to everyone trying to get Hawaii to answer yes or no: is this a legit certificate?

  4. Gene Berkman

    So is Alan Keyes trying to say that if a Democrat is elected who is a legit American citizen, he would not push through a government takeover of health care; that a Democrat born in the USA would not talk about raising taxes; or that a Democrat who is a natural born citizen would respect the Constitution and limited government?

    That is even less plausible than a 45 year plot to put a foreign born Muslim in the White House.

  5. Red Phillips

    I don’t know if the long form Obama released is real or fake. There is A LOT of stuff coming out by people who seem informed about computer imaging who are skeptical, to say the least, of its authenticity. I am withholding judgment because I am pretty much technically illiterate so I don’t know who to believe. I would like to see several independent evaluations by certified forensic document specialists. (Something that would be happening as we speak if our press was doing its job instead of shilling for Obama.)

    But it is not rational to dismiss out of hand claims of fraud and to accept at face value the authenticity of something presented by someone who has, shall we say, a big stake in the outcome.

    If the tendency to accept conspiracies with a low threshold of proof is an indication of an undisciplined mind, it is also true that the tendency to dismiss out of hand conspiracy theories (unless they are outrageous on their face) because they are conspiracy theories or fear of taint or whatever is equally indicative of an undisciplined mind.

    Let’s take Phillies for example. You are a typical Blue American elitist who looks down your nose at us Red American rubes in flyover country. You clearly wants Obama to be legit and all the rubes in flyover country fretting about birth certificates to be wrong. It would devastate your Blue America world for a bunch of ignorant hicks to have actually been on to something. You are emotionally invested in the outcome and therefore WANT the document to be authentic. So you dismisses claims that it is not authentic preemptively without examining them. This is undisciplined, emotionally influenced thinking. Your quick resort to the “tin foil hat” slur in lieu of an argument is evidence of this.

    I thought you are an academic. You are supposed to look at evidence critically, weigh it, and then arrive at a conclusion if possible based on the evidence. Dismissing an entirely plausible charge of fraud out of hand without examining it is not befitting a trained academic and scientist.

    It is also a pretty sad position for a Libertarian. I though Libertarians distrusted government and government officials. So government can’t run health care or manage the economy, but it is completely implausible that Obama is hiding something and attempting to deceive?

    Do me a favor. Actually examine the stuff out there already claiming the bc is a fraud and then get back to us. I’ll give you a link to the most compelling and professional stuff if you so desire, or you can weed through it all. (There’s a lot of junk also.) I don’t know how much you know about computers, but I’m sure you know a lot about optics so you might actually be able to contribute to the debate. But until you have examined the evidence we have so far, such as it is, please spare us the tin foil hat references.

  6. Red Phillips

    “That is even less plausible than a 45 year plot to put a foreign born Muslim in the White House.”

    @Gene, that is a canard, and you know it. It is not necessary that there be some decades old plot to install Obama in the White House. All that is necessary is for part of Obama’s narrative to be false or embarrassing in some way, which he later has to cover up. Once you tell the lie you have to stick with it. So let’s say, for the sake of the argument, that the big secret is that BO Sr. wasn’t really his dad and that was just a ruse to cover up the illegitimate impregnation of a 17 yr old. (One thing that has been speculated.) That would have nothing to do with him being President years later. It would just be a lie once told and oft’ repeated that he was then stuck with. If anything, from what I have read, Obama’s initial ambition was to be the Mayor of Chicago. The President thing didn’t come until later. So you can rest easy that whatever is going on, if anything, isn’t a plot from birth to install Obama in the White House.

  7. Lmack

    Barry brought this on himself. If his character were such that we could believe his assertions, this would go away. His character is flawed and this will not go away. All politicians rise and fall based on the perception of integrity.

  8. Michael H. Wilson

    Red you wrote “Let’s take Phillies for example. You are a typical Blue American elitist who looks down your nose at us Red American rubes in flyover country. You clearly wants Obama to be legit and all the rubes in flyover country fretting about birth certificates to be wrong. It would devastate your Blue America world for a bunch of ignorant hicks to have actually been on to something.

    Red I have talked to met George and he is quite civil in person. Perhaps he doesn’t come across that way on the net, but as someone who doesn’t have letters behind my name he has always treated me with respect. Just another comment from someone who once upon a time had red hair before the age sh*t set in.

  9. George Phillies

    Red,

    I am giving the birther claims the full respect they deserve, which is to say, approximately none.

    Mind you, I am all in favor of the Republicans running a birther team for the White House. Angle-Trump comes to mind in either order.

    George

  10. RedPhillips Post author

    “I am giving the birther claims the full respect they deserve, which is to say, approximately none.”

    I rest my case.

    I don’t have much use for the “birther” claim, if that means Obama was born in Kenya. I do, however, think he is likely hiding something in all the documents he is refusing to release. And I submit that thinking he is hiding something is an entirely plausible explanation for his behavior. (In fact, I think that he is hiding something is the explanation most consistent with Occam razor.) There are other plausible explanations, but suspecting he is hiding something is plausible on its face and anyone who says it isn’t is not looking at the matter objectively.

  11. Jeremy C. Young

    Red, what frustrates me about all this is that the birth certificate isn’t what’s really at issue for birthers, yet that’s what you fixate on. For instance, take this passage you wrote, which could apply equally well to me, as a leftist academic who opposes birtherism:

    You are a typical Blue American elitist who looks down your nose at us Red American rubes in flyover country. You clearly wants Obama to be legit and all the rubes in flyover country fretting about birth certificates to be wrong. It would devastate your Blue America world for a bunch of ignorant hicks to have actually been on to something.

    Well, okay; fair enough. But by the same token, you are a typical Red American rube who looks down your nose at us Blue American elitists on the coasts. You clearly want Obama to be illegitimate and all the elitists insisting the birth certificate is the real deal to be wrong. It would devastate your Red America world for a bunch of liberal elitists to have actually been on to something.

    Now that we understand one another, let me point out the obvious: this isn’t about Obama’s birth certificate at all. This is about people on one side of a vast cultural divide seeing Obama as a symbol of everything they don’t like about the people on the other side, and people on the other side seeing birtherism as a symbol of everything they don’t like about the people on the other side. And you know what? That’s fine. Let’s talk about that. Let’s talk about how my side unfairly dismisses the concerns of your side, and your side unfairly prejudges my side. That’s a discussion worth having.

    But when you make it instead about a birth certificate and whether Obama had things handed to him and whether he’s hiding something, what we get is a ridiculous spectacle of people talking past one another. You get your people saying that a piece of paper is not a piece of paper, when what they really mean is that the birth certificate doesn’t settle the underlying cultural problems that Obama represents. You get my people saying that your people’s legitimate anger is laughable, when what we really mean is that you should shut up about the stupid piece of paper and just say what you’re really upset about. None of this helps anybody, except to make our country look like a farce and to make everyone even angrier than they are already.

    So why don’t we just talk about what we’re really upset about, and leave the birth certificate out of it?

  12. RedPhillips Post author

    “no one but Ambassador Keyes ever cared before about the date sequence matching the key sequence.”

    @ FSVE #1

    Actually FSVE, the number on the long form matches the number on the previously released short form. (If it didn’t that would obviously be a big problem.) And people have been comparing that number to the Nordyke Twins number and asking questions since the short form was released.

    I have thought from the beginning that pronouncing the bc a forgery based on that sequencing issue is a stretch. If the numbers were way off that might be a little harder to explain, but since the numbers were close I figured there might be a benign explanation.

    Your explanation: “Big hospitals don’t send each form in sequentially by date; they batch them up and send a number at a time. Vital Statistics personnel don’t sort them sequentially by date either;” strikes me as an entirely reasonable explanation. It is a BIG overreach to state dogmatically that this sequencing issue “proves” the document is a fake.

    See George, that is how it is done. You dispassionately weigh the evidence and then reach a conclusion. You should try it.

  13. FAN of Dr. STAN

    I believe that Keyes is a nut case. I have felt that way since ’08.

    Many more people are saying this thing is a fake. If so that is yet another IMPEACHABLE offense!

    B.O. takes over the national airwaves to announce this?! That my friend is a problem. B.O. is the LEAST qualified POTUS in any of our lifetimes. He continues to show that major FACT !!!

  14. Zeleni

    I heard that Susan E. Nordyke forged her birth certificate to cover up the existence of her vestigial tail which was removed by Keyes. #notintendedtobeafactualstatement

  15. LibertarianGirl

    of course its a fake , the lizard people made it and everyone knows they do the best counterfeiting – hence why they look like humans but are actually lizards

  16. JT

    What a shocker–birthers still won’t accept the legitimacy of Obama’s election. Would anything satisfy them? No.

  17. LibertarianGirl

    i agree JT , saw that comin a mile away, you could have the dr’s ,nurses , hosp staff , testify , you could have video , pics and audio and it wouldnt matter , its all fake , because like I said , those fucking lizard people can fake anything

  18. Red Phillips

    Is talking about “lizard people” supposed to be funny? It isn’t. Clever? It isn’t. It, like the use of “tin foil hats” or “wacko” or whatever, is substituting slur and snark for intelligent discourse. It is childish and ought to be below anyone who fanscies himself/herself a contributor to rational discourse.

    I shouldn’t have to remind everyone that A LOT of people consider all libertarians and third party people in general “wacko.” Why do you want to endorse the use of snark and derision in lieu of legitimate discourse when it is bound to be used against you more than it will ever “benefit” you?

    Grow up!

  19. FAN of Dr. STAN

    B.O. by Indonesian law had to renounce his U.S. citizenship to be adopted by his Indonesian Step Father. B.O.’s real name is Barry if it hasn’t been LEGALLY changed by law. There are some Ds (yes Ds) who say he is an ILLEGAL Alien, just like so many of these central Americans walking our streets. That’s right if the birth question was solved, he still must answer to when he BECAME an American citizen after his adoption and Indonesian citizenship (which in those days forbid dual citizenship) !

    America is a Republic of Laws, that’s what (use to anyway) keeps them from taking you away in the middle of the night and torturing you if they want without due process! You must be eligible to be POTUS by LAW, if not you are NOT eligible and legally cannot (should not) hold the position. Period.

    Many may tire of the so-called “birthers” but they are attempting to protect the Republic and her government of LAWS. Not a bad goal in the scheme of things. It’s (laws) what protects what few freedoms we still have. If B.O. isn’t eligible to hold the position he sure shouldn’t be sending our men and women to KILL and be KILLED !

    ~~~

    “There is no flag large enough to cover the shame of killing innocent people. ” -Historian Howard Zinn

    The Flag of the Corporate States of America By Charles Sullivan: http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_charles__060614_the_flag_of_the_corp.htm

    The Corporate Flag and Fascism: http://www.spectrumz.com/z/corporate_flag.html

    You may wish to repeat after IronBoltBruce:

    “I pledge no allegiance to the flag of the Corporate States of America, or to the Kleptocracy which stole the land, and plunged our nation into debt,
    insurmountable, with questionable futures for all.”

    –Bruce Arnold, 19-Nov-2010

    ~~~
    Now you can go back to your reptile jokes, it’s so productive in protecting our lives and freedoms…

  20. JT

    I agree with your post 24, Red.

    I also think that those people who continue to tout the birther theory now are beyond any rational discourse. They’re just people who hate Obama passionately and can’t/won’t believe that he could occupy the White House legitimately. And they never will believe it, no matter what evidence is presented. It’s too unfathomable to them.

  21. RedPhillips Post author

    If by “birther theory” you mean that he was born in Kenya, then I agree that people who still dogmatically believe that do so because they want to believe that. But “birtherism” I believe long ago expanded into more of general doubts about the Obama narrative in toto and the belief that he is hiding something embarrasiing in all his unreleased records. I believe that belief was and is still entirely rational.

  22. JT

    Red: “But “birtherism” I believe long ago expanded into more of general doubts about the Obama narrative in toto and the belief that he is hiding something embarrasiing in all his unreleased records. I believe that belief was and is still entirely rational.”

    First, what are you referring to exactly? A vague, unspecified suspicion that “something isn’t right” isn’t rational.

    Second, the rest of the “Obama narrative” wouldn’t have import on his legitimacy to be President. So I don’t know why anyone would care.

  23. Gene Berkman

    Let me make clear – I oppose President Obama and his socialistic domestic policies, and I oppose his continuation of President Bush’s wars in the Middle East.

    But trying to prove that he is not legally qualified to be President, and thinking that if he is driven from office after it is proved he is not a citizen, is the least effective way to oppose Obama’s programs and policies.

    Even if he resigns from office, the money he spent is already spent, the debt is already a burden, and the government has already expanded its control of our healthcare and our business activities.

    When President Nixon resigned under threat of impeachment, his policies remained in place. Price controls on oil outlasted Nixon’s period in office by 6 years, and Red China still has a permanent seat on the UN Security Council.

    ““birtherism” I believe long ago expanded into more of general doubts about the Obama narrative in toto and the belief that he is hiding something embarrasiing in all his unreleased records.”

    It really does seem that osme of Obama’s opponents have adopted a totalitarian contempt for personal privacy, and that makes some of us as uncomfortable as the President’s willingness to raid medical marijuana dispensaries.

  24. Don Lake, FYI, not necessarily a unilateral endorsement

    ………. I oppose his continuation of President Bush’s wars in the Middle East ………..

    that makes some of us as uncomfortable as the President’s willingness to raid medical marijuana dispensaries ………. [Lake: as some one whom has never used pot ……]

    [a] not a ‘birther’

    [b] window for Opeach Obama is closing

  25. NewFederalist

    “Now you can go back to your reptile jokes, it’s so productive in protecting our lives and freedoms…”

    That battle is already lost. We might as well have as much fun as we can before it’s over. Time is short. Have some fun.

  26. LibertarianGirl

    RP_It is childish and ought to be below anyone who fanscies himself/herself a contributor to rational discourse.

    me_ Birtherism has nothing to do with rational discourse , nothing at all.

  27. RedPhillips Post author

    “Birtherism has nothing to do with rational discourse, nothing at all.”

    LG, it depends on what you mean by birtherism. The idea that Obama was born in Kenya has always been implausible, but the suspicion he may be hiding damaging information in all the records he refuses to release is entirely rational. Wanting to know why he has a Connecticut SSN is rational. Wanting to know if his selective service registration card is a forgery is rational. Wanting to know if he formally became an Indonesian citizen is rational. Wanting to know if he travelled to Pakistan on a foreign passport is rational. Wanting to know if he attended school as a foreign student is rational. And if you say it isn’t rational you are not being rational. You are being emotional.

    And it is also rational to want to know if the original intent of the Founders when they chose the words “natural born citizen” was to exclude people born with dual citizenship, but this is a separate question since his dual citizenship at birth is not debated.

  28. Ted Brown

    The other odd part of Obama’s documentation is the fact that his Social Security number was issued in Connecticut, when he never lived there. The most likely explanation is that he is a cyborg that was created in a lab in Connecticut, most likely by whichever defense contractor is controlling his actions right now. 🙂

  29. RedPhillips Post author

    “A vague, unspecified suspicion that “something isn’t right” isn’t rational.”

    I beg to differ. Of course it could be. Like Wayne Root wrote in his recent column, people are suspicious of Obama because he has acted suspiciously. In fact, it seems irrational to me to not be suspicious of someone acting suspiciously. Does Obama get a pass because he is a high government official and to think he might be hiding something would be a conspiracy theory?

    “First, what are you referring to exactly?”

    See 35 for a partial list. Inquiring minds want to know. Why shouldn’t they? Why is deliberate incuriosity a virtue?

  30. Thomas L. Knapp

    @25,

    “B.O. by Indonesian law had to renounce his U.S. citizenship to be adopted by his Indonesian Step Father.”

    And by US law a minor cannot renounce his US citizenship, nor can his parents or guardians do so on his behalf.

    Q: Which law applies to US elections — US law or Indonesian law?

  31. RedPhillips Post author

    @ Ted Brown #36,

    Regarding Obama’s CT SSN, prominent conspiracy debunker Dr. Conspiracy says the most likely explanation is that it was a clerical error.

    OK. That’s plausible, but we are supposed to accept that as the final word? “Well it might have been a clerical error. Guess I can rest easy now.” Give me a break. To be satisfied with the explanation that it might have been a clerical error is willful, deliberate incuriosity. “Move along now. Nothing to see here.” If there was a similar issue with a Republican President there is no way the press would accept that as an answer and everyone knows it. Here the press is completely looking the other way. It was left up to an independent blogger to come up with the clerical error explanation.

    Such deliberate incuriosity on the part of so many is embarrassing.

  32. Jill Pyeatt

    I don’t consider myself a “birther” but I agree with Red that poking fun at those who sincerely think there’s something wrong with Obama’s shrouded history is counter-productive. Calling people names instead of having honest discussion is an indicator to me that the name-thrower is not very educated. I guess my folks taught me that people who call other people names are seriously lacking in intelligence and integrity.

  33. Thomas L. Knapp

    Red @41,

    “If there was a similar issue with a Republican President there is no way the press would accept that as an answer and everyone knows it.”

    I don’t recall a single mainstream press outfit going after John McCain about the the fact the he is a naturalized, rather than “natural born,” US citizen in 2008.

    He was born in the Panama Canal Zone in 1936. It was not until 1937 that the US Congress made the Zone an incorporated US territory and people born there to American citizens “natural born” citizens. At the time of his birth, he was legally considered a “US national” eligible for automatic naturalization upon application.

  34. Thomas L. Knapp

    I’ve also come across no historical evidence that George Romney, Mitt’s dad and the front-runner for the GOP’s 1964 presidential nomination until an internal party revolt put Goldwater over the top, faced any kind of severe questioning about the fact that he was born in Mexico.

  35. FAN of Dr. STAN

    I received this email from
    Colonel Robert F. Cunningham
    1826 Poplar Lane SW
    Albuquerque NM 87105
    505 247 4843

    “OBAMA BIRTH CERTIFICATE IS PHONY!

    Just another media-hyped communist con-game – and cracked within an hour of release – despite media coverage ever since without mention of the obvious forgery (deliberate suppression?).

    While it remains available, download the pdf document from the White House site;

    http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/birth-certificate-long-form.pdf

    Then open it in Adobe Illustrator – the LAYERS are clear and absolute! A pdf file shouldn’t have LAYERS and a pristine file shouldn’t have evidence of tampering. This phony document has both!

    Anyone can do it and EVERYONE who does will know the damned thing is a manufactured forgery. Only communist media and politicians will continue to hype this atrocity as valid; and only RINOs (closet communists) will keep silent about, or dismiss, the issue.”

    Needless to say the Col. thinks the commies are heavily involved in this deal !!!
    Root needs to put the Col. on his inner circle !-lol

  36. Geebus, Would You People go READ something!

    The birth certificate is a red herring.

    The real issue is what an Article II “natural-born” citizen is.

    Anyone who picks up a copy of de Vattels’ “Law of Nations”, the only book cited in the Constitution, will find that term clearly defined as such:

    * A natural-born citizen is a person born in this country of two citizen parents.

    This was also cited in an 1875 Supreme Court case, which was after the 14th Amendment was ratified.

    McCain was naturalized in 1952 per Congressional legislation dealing specifically with Canal Zone births. That law is still on the books at 8 USC 1403(a) . His parents were US citizens, but he was not born on US soil, therefore he was not natural-born.

    Obama, if he was born in Hawaii, was born to a US Citizen mother and a British subject father. Therefore both of his parents were not US Citizens and he isn’t a natural-born citizen either.

    Had the proper research been done in advance of the 2008 election, and the law correctly applied, the outcome would have been much different, and we’d be in a different world now.

  37. LibertarianGirl

    Look man , the dude is the most powerful man o the planet , if there was anything to hide , dontcha think the handlers and power brokers would have hidden it better? logic simply dictates there is nothing to see concerning B.O’s birth certificate. Its a red herring issue and trust me they are laughing their asses off about the wild goose chase so many are focused on

  38. JT

    I said: “A vague, unspecified suspicion that “something isn’t right” isn’t rational.”

    Red: “I beg to differ. Of course it could be.”

    Rational means belief based on factual evidence. It’s not some kind of hunch that can be attributed to any number of factors.

    Red: “See 35 for a partial list. Inquiring minds want to know. Why shouldn’t they? Why is deliberate incuriosity a virtue?”

    I didn’t say it was a virtue. I said I don’t get why anyone would care about things that have no import for Obama’s eligibility for President. I care about what he’s doing now politically, not what happened earlier in his life. Most people probably feel the same way.

  39. NewFederalist

    I concur with LG. The clincher for me… don’t you think the Clintons would have jumped all over this in the 2008 primaries if it had legs? Does anyone posting here think the Bill and/or Hillary Clinton would not have done ANYTHING to win the nomination for Hillary? If there was any chance to exploit this “issue” even just to cast doubt on his citizenship to primary voters to get the few extra votes she needed to win the nomination, they would have done it. That is why I have never allowed myself to get interested in this.

  40. Darryl W. Perry

    I want to see George Washington’s birth certificate… wait, that’s right there were no government issued birth certificates back then…

    “The original purpose of birth registration was for tax purposes and for the determination of available military manpower. Births were initially registered with churches, who maintained registers of births.
    The compulsory registration of births with governmental agencies is a practice that originated in the United Kingdom in 1853.

  41. George Phillies

    From RedHampshire.com and the Manchester Union-Leader

    Yes, REDHampshire and Fergus Cullin: An immortal quote.

    “A Public Policy Polling survey found that 48 percent of Iowa Republicans don’t believe President Obama was born in the United States, and another 26 percent said they weren’t sure if he was or if he wasn’t. It’s hard to talk about real issues when three quarters of the audience wears tin foil hats.”

    On the bright side, the issue will do a fine job of convincing most Americans that conservatives are all lunatics, idiots, and seditious liars.

    On the dim side, the issue will do a fine job of making it impossible for good conservatives to make their sane points heard.

    The good conservatives might consider emulating William F Buckley Jr and reading the birthers, truthers, anthropogenic-global-warming deniers, creationists, and flat-earthers out of the conservative political movement, while there is still a conservative movement left.

  42. Red Phillips

    I see George, it is outrageous for conservatives to reject AGW based on ideology without reviewing the evidence, but it is perfectly OK for you to reject concerns about Obama without reviewing the evidence. I got it. Phillies and his Blue American buddies are special and the same rules don’t apply to them that apply to us flyover country Red American rubes.

    Thanks George. You are doing a great job proving my point for me.

  43. Don Lake, FYI, not necessarily a unilateral endorsement

    If the ‘conservative movement’ * is not vital and valuable to the greater discourse, then it does not DESERVE to exist!

    And I have always been leery of solving today and tomorrow’s problems with the same ole raggedy, failed ‘solutions’ of the past.

    * substitution(s):

    Reform / Deform Party / movement

    American Socialism

    forced religion on to secular politics

    The American imperial global empire

    racism, closeted or blatant

    ………. I’m just sayin’ …………

  44. Thomas L. Knapp

    “A natural-born citizen is a person born in this country of two citizen parents.

    “This was also cited in an 1875 Supreme Court case, which was after the 14th Amendment was ratified.”

    And in 1880, the child of an Irish national (Chester Alan Arthur) was elected vice-president and subsequently became president upon the assassination of Garfield, making it pretty clear that the “two citizen parents” requirement was no longer considered valid by that point.

  45. Don Lake, FYI, not necessarily a unilateral endorsement

    Oh the laughter of God when we, including the unethical Clintons, inform the Universe that we ‘have plans’!

    If only ‘don’t expect me to be humming Tammy Wynett’s “Stand By Your Man” ‘ Hitleray Klinton had NOT taken the job at State.

    Senator from New York State or private citizen, I see her being the biggest ‘birther’ on the planet and a near shoe in for P2012!

    Incumbent Opeach Obama would not even make it thru the primaries next year against a ‘free floating’ Mrs. Clinton. Oh, the fork less taken ………..

  46. Red Phillips

    Tom, the Senate passed 99-0 a non-binding resolution saying McCain is a natural born citizen. Obama voted for it. McCain abstained. So someone was trying to address it. I agree that the MSM didn’t much pursue the story but the blogosphere (left and right) did some. In fact, when I tried to look into the original intent of natural born, it was mostly addressed on conservative sites regarding McCain.

    That said, from what I have studied about the issue, McCain probably wasn’t technically a natural born citizen although it is murky. He was granted citizenship retroactively. So he probably wasn’t technically eligible to be President. Never let it be said that I am not an equal opportunity stickler for details.

    In my efforts to look into this, I have run into concerns about Romney being born in Mexico and Goldwater because he was born in AZ while it was still a territory.

    I am not convinced that natural born requires being born on us soil although a case can be made that it does. But I think a stronger case can be made that natural born requires two citizen parents.

  47. Former Vital Statistics Employee

    I think the “birther” issue is a non-starter but Obama’s academic record is more worthy of exploration. I was admitted to Columbia back in the day but turned down by Pitt much to my embarrassment; of course as a true West Virginian I never really wanted to go anywhere but WVU or Marshall. So the fact of Obama’s admission doesn’t say much but his transcript sure might.

  48. glenno

    nobody believes this kenyan and i didn’t from day 1 but they will still vote him back in just to be part of this historic escapade you get what you vote for

  49. Geebus, Would You People go READ something!

    “And in 1880, the child of an Irish national (Chester Alan Arthur) was elected vice-president and subsequently became president upon the assassination of Garfield, making it pretty clear that the “two citizen parents” requirement was no longer considered valid by that point.”

    Nobody ever challenged Arthur on the point. That doesn’t make it valid, just ignored.

    A law broken and ignored is still a law broken. Ignoring it does not suddenly make it legal.

    C’mon, you’re supposed to be smarter than that!

  50. Ted Brown

    @58
    Regarding Chester Alan Arthur:
    The 1880 election saw the first “birthers.” While Arthur’s official bio said that he was born in Fairfield, VT, near the Canadian border, it was always rumored that he had really been born in Quebec, Canada, right across the border in another town where his minister father preached. A journalist traveled all over that area and tried to find out the truth, but couldn’t make a determination. Thus, there was no real evidence that Arthur was anything but U. S. -born. That doesn’t answer the question about “natural born citizen,” but it shows that the issue is not new to our time.

  51. Geebus, Would You People go READ something!

    ‘I am not convinced that natural born requires being born on us soil although a case can be made that it does. ”

    That was proven long ago, Red. See also the State Department—specifically, their Foreign Affairs Manual, in 7 FAM 1100—addresses the situation quite clearly:

    7 FAM 1111.2 Citizenship

    (TL:CON-64; 11-30-95)

    a. U.S. citizenship may be acquired either at birth or through naturalization.

    b. U.S. laws governing the acquisition of citizenship at birth embody two legal principles:

    (1) Jus soli (the law of the soil), a rule of common law under which the place of a person’s birth determines citizenship. In addition to common law, this principle is embodied in the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution and the various U.S. citizenship and nationality statutes.

    (2) Jus sanguinis (the law of the bloodline), a concept of Roman or civil law under which a person’s citizenship is determined by the citizenship of one or both parents. This rule, frequently called “citizenship by descent” or “derivative citizenship”, is not embodied in the U.S. Constitution, but such citizenship is granted through statute. As laws have changed, the requirements for conferring and retaining derivative citizenship have also changed. (emphasis added)

    7 FAM 1116.1-4 Not Included in the Meaning of “In the United States”

    (TL:CON-64; 11-30-95)

    c. Despite widespread popular belief, U.S. military installations abroad and U.S. diplomatic or consular facilities are not part of the United States within the meaning of the 14th Amendment. A child born on the premises of such a facility is not subject to the jurisdiction of the United States and does not acquire U.S. citizenship by reason of birth.

    An Article II citizen (natural born) is not the same as a 14th Amendment citizen, because an Article II citizen has an extra requirement attached to it. In summary:

    14th Amendment naturalized citizen: not born on U.S. soil, gone through naturalization process or declared by Congress in statutes

    14th Amendment born citizen: born on U.S. soil

    Article II citizen: 14th Amendment born citizen born to U.S. citizen parents (both)

    To be President, one must be an Article II citizen. McCain is not (naturalized), and Obama is not (father not a U.S. citizen).

    It’s really that simple.

  52. Geebus, Would You People go READ something!

    Besides, if Obama actually is an Article II citizen, then he has committed felony fraud in his CT SSA and his foreign scholarship application at Occidental, and that’s impeachable by itself.

  53. Geebus, Would You People go READ something!

    “In my efforts to look into this, I have run into concerns about Romney being born in Mexico and Goldwater because he was born in AZ while it was still a territory.”

    George Romney dropped out before it became an issue (and he wasn’t eligible, either from being born outside the U.S.).

    Goldwater was eligible because the Arizona Territory, while still being only a territory, was still in the United States (assuming his parents were both U.S. citizens).

  54. Franz Ferdinand

    It just doesn’t matter.

    You know they use the latest training from the Soviet Union, East and West Germany and the newest olympic powerhouse Trinidad and Tobago.

    But it just doesn’t matter.

    It just doesn’t matter.

  55. TooTallTom

    Mr Obama, irrespective of seemingly valid concerns about the legitamacy of your LFBC, I have a couple of simple questions for you that in and of themselves could settle this issue once and for all.

    I haven’t read all the comments herein so if this question is redundant consider that fact.

    To me a question that ‘screams’ to be answered by Obama is: If “THAT” is your bonafide Long Form BC then why did you spend countless hundreds of thousands of dollars to fight having to produce “THAT” in some 18 court cases to compell you to show “THAT” if you had nothing to hide? Is that question ‘too simple’ to answer?

    Secondly, Mr Obama, if in fact your LFBC is legit, why not go ahead and show corroborated birth records from the alleged hospital of your birth.

    And finally Mr Obama, if you have nothing to hide, why was one of your first acts as POTUS to have all your personal records sealed?

    It seems to me Mr Obama, by the preponderance of the scope of that one act, you have MUCH TO HIDE! That should be plain to see and understand by anyone with only getting-out-of-the-rain-sense.

    Mr Obama, your multitude of lies and deceits WILL BE FOUND OUT! And rather than being remembered as the first AFRICAN/AMERICAN (?) POTUS you will be remembered as the BIGGEST FRAUD IN THE HISTORY OF THE MODERN DAY WORLD! And for that you will have single handedly set back and forever impeded the legitimate advancement of African American men and women throughout the world.

    Let God be true and every evil man a lier.

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