Live Blogging the Libertarian National Committee Meeting July 17, 2016


Further updates in comments below.

This post is started in order to share information about the upcoming Libertarian Party National Committee meeting to take place in Las Vegas on July 17, 2016. An IPR editor is planning on attending live in order to live blog. The meeting will be transmitted via video at:

Broadcast channel #1 – video and audio:

The audio-only channel, formerly provided by Gary Johnson (TX), will no longer be provided as Johnson is no longer on the LNC.

The location for the meeting is at Planet Hollywood, Las Vegas,in the Melrose 3 Meeting Room on the Mezzanine (2nd) Level (North Tower Side) just past the Business Center beginning at 9:00 am.

The Chair’s proposed agenda is here:

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This post will be updated as further information becomes available.

This entry was posted in Libertarian Party on by .

About Caryn Ann Harlos

Caryn Ann Harlos is a paralegal residing in Castle Rock, Colorado and presently serving as the Region 1 Representative on the Libertarian National Committee and is a candidate for LNC Secretary at the 2018 Libertarian Party Convention. Articles posted should NOT be considered the opinions of the LNC nor always those of Caryn Ann Harlos personally. Caryn Ann's goal is to provide information on items of interest and (sometimes) controversy about the Libertarian Party and minor parties in general not to necessarily endorse the contents.

133 thoughts on “Live Blogging the Libertarian National Committee Meeting July 17, 2016

  1. Joseph Buchman

    I believe the editor Caryn referenced above is ME! I am here, Internet seems to be working in this part of the hotel (not sure about the strength of the connection in the LNC meeting room), but I was able to post the article about Johnson, Weld, Barr, Gray and Root all being here now.

    Any requests from IPR readers about how to best BLOG the LNC meeting are welcome.


  2. Chuck Moulton

    I won’t be able to follow this meeting live for most of the day due to visiting extended family.

    I hope someone else liveblogs. If not, I’ll look forward to reading the minutes.

  3. Joseph Buchman

    9:04 Call to order
    9:05 Dr. Lark requests a one minute standing ovation for Dr. Mark Feldman
    Opportunity for public comment.
    John Moore Update campaign for reelection going well. Has raised $55K, $40K from Chris Rufer. His opponent apparently has $250K
    End of public comment.

    Discussion of adoption of the agenda, LNC at large moved earlier to allow new member to be appointed to committees, 10 minutes to discuss John Moore’s campaign. Mr. Katz requests five minutes to discuss relationship with the Johnson campaign. Redpath requests more time for Ballot access, chair suggests 20 minutes. 5 minutes requested by Harlos for outreach to Log Cabin Republicans. Chair requests deleting population of the convention oversight committee for this meeting.

    9:21 Motion adopted as amended.

  4. Joseph Buchman

    9:22 Discussion of conflicts of interest. Secretary reports members are being highly detailed with potential conflicts.

    Chair suggests that members consider whether a potential conflict will actually arise. He is a cannabis company counsel, for example and reports that, but does not report all of his other clients.

    9:25 Chair’s report, submitted in writing earlier . . .

  5. Joseph Buchman

    Chair reports that he, Wes, Robert, Lauren, etc have been here for Freedom Fest – reports it was a rousing success. Governor Johnson won the straw poll at FF. Fundraising event at KOI, recognizes Lauren (special projects director). Many contacts with pre 1983 ex-Libertarians who are considering returning. New doors open.

    Starchild asks about merchandise sales at the booth.

    Chair reports that Mr. Hays was helpful. Along with other party member volunteers. Chair reports fewer fights this year (arguments with booth droppers by).

    Redpath asks if there is a staff report. How are things going downticket? The POTUS campaign is blotting out the sun — Chair mentions LillyforLiberty from Colorado as an example.

    (Ed note- see: )

    We are taking advantage of the unforced errors that the OLD OLD OLD parties are making.

    Chair moves to move the December LNC meeting to the weekend of the 10th/11th.

  6. Joseph Buchman

    Starchild moves to move the meeting to pre-election (probably September).

    Roll call (I can’t hear well enough to record individual names); fails 10 to 4.

    Vote on moving December meeting to the 10th/11th. passes 10 to 1.

    Wes asks for help with the speaker phone.

    9:40 Treasurer’s report occurring now.

  7. Joseph Buchman

    9:50AM Further discussion postponed to post Ballot Access Committee report.

    Hagan moves to increase brand development expenditures to $100K. Lark seconds.

    Passes without objection.

    Starchild moves to allow alternates to participate. No second.

    Hagan moves to increase the media relations budget from $3k to $10K for a contractor (Rachael Mills) who will handle press releases. Funds to come from administrative expenses. Passes without objection.

    10:00AM Secretary’s report begins.

  8. Joseph Buchman

    LNC begins discussion of filling Dr. Feldman’s former seat on the LNC. Carlos suggests picking the next person in line from the convention, just as Dr. Feldman’s seat was filled. Madson proposes that the next-in-line is not the best method because run-off election could have gone differently. With numbers in the 30 percent range, then a standard election should be used. Moves to open nominations. Seconded by the vice-chair Vohra. Harlos argues that the LNC did not create a structure that ensured delegates had the time and efficiency to vote, at large speeches were cut short. Given only 7 weeks out from the convention. Expresses concerns about appearance of a “power grab.”

  9. Thomas Knapp

    The vote at the convention was approval voting, so there’s really no case that the “next in line” candidates who did NOT receive majority support are automatically entitled to open at large seats. If a majority of the delegates supported those candidates, they were perfectly free to vote for those candidates.

  10. Joseph Buchman

    Dr. Lark proposes, despite his voting to fill seats in the order of delegate vote totals even when they were under 50 percent, that the best way to proceed is that no one who gets less than 50 percent from delegates should be considered at this point because we have NOTA as an option.

    Vohra explains that should a delegate approve of three people and then of no one else, in effect voted for 2 NOTA votes that were not recorded.

    Harlos proposes that because this has happened in the past it is a structural issue and one the LNC should be accountable for. Why would we consider people who did not campaign and who did not put themselves in front of the delegates only seven weeks ago? We should be sure this does not happen at our next convention.

    Demarest proposes consistency in the process — namely filling the seat with the next person in-line of total votes from the convention.

    Mr. Redpath speaks against the substitute. Also mentions he would support a repeal of the majority requirement for approval voting. Dr. Feldman and others should have been elected directly (and would have been if not for the majority requirement).

    Starchild speaks in favor of the substitute process. Quotes bylaws regarding NOTA being available as an option. Suggests approval voting is in conflict with the bylaws.

    Madson speaks against the substitute motion. There is no precedent for how to fill open seats on the LNC. Many processes have been used. Approval process is not something “sneaky to give the LNC more power.” In Columbus we had 5 people who got a majority on the first ballot, but had time for the delegates to break a tie for the 5th position.

    Harlos speaks in favor of the substitute. She is not accusing anyone of being sneaky, but of the appearance of impropriety which is also important. At Large and Judicial committee elections are consistently rushed.

    Motion fails 10 to 4. Nominations to fill the open seat are now open.

  11. Joseph Buchman

    Reports that CNN is now polling Johnson/Weld at 13 percent. Online poll in Utah has Johnson/Weld at 54 percent. Have hired 35 new staff plus 40 full time volunteers. Now using Nation Builder. Youth movement organized. Campaign is second with millennials and independents. Targeting Republican Hispanics as well. Goals are — 1) Get to 15 percent by Labor Day. CPD polls occur after Labor Day. Focused on earned media (not advertising). Both candidates will be in Cleveland to be interviewed by media that is there. Will not be allowed inside the hall. Looking at going to Democratic Convention as well.

    2) Targeting specific states with large groups of independents, Libertarians and not as much money being spent by the OLD party campaigns. Ohio would not be a target, for example. Targeting Nevada, New Mexico, Colorado, Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, and maybe Oregon and Iowa. Jesse Ventura just gave an endorsement so Minnesota may be in play. Research being done there.

    Rationale — show momentum in some states, focus on the Electoral College. It is no secret that our goal is to throw the election into the House. Thus to target on Democratic states to keep the Democratic campaign from winning the EC.

    Starchild — are there efforts for backup debates?

    Nielson – lots of requests for debates between Libertarians and Greens. No R or D candidate will debate outside of the CPD due to contract agreements.

  12. Joseph Buchman

    Lawsuits have yet to enter the discovery phase. Hope to get access to the contracts with the CPD.

    Starchild asks who the Governors advisers are? Are they Libertarians giving good solid positioning advice?

    Nielson responds that Gary is a very pragmatic, realistic analyst and that CATO has opened the doors to the campaign at all hours to discuss issues. Looking at what works.

    Discussion of helping downticket candidates/downticket candidates helping Johnson/Weld.

  13. Daniel Hayes

    Bill Redpath wants to talk ballot access to Ron Nielson. Shocking development!

  14. Joseph Buchman

    Discussion of what the LNC can do to help get to 15 percent.

    Discussion of how much the Johnson/Weld campaign can spend on Ballot Access. Had offered $150k, not sure how much is left.

    Discussion of creating a radical think tank advisory group for the campaign.

    Discussion of FEC lawsuit and 3 verses 4 (or more) candidate polls.

  15. Be Rational

    “Targeting specific states with large groups of independents, Libertarians and not as much money being spent by the OLD party campaigns. Ohio would not be a target, for example.

    Targeting Nevada, New Mexico, Colorado, Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, and maybe Oregon and Iowa. Jesse Ventura just gave an endorsement so Minnesota may be in play.”

    Very good list of targets.

    They could have bought a lot of advertising instead of hiring 35 additional staff members.

  16. Thomas Knapp

    “They could have bought a lot of advertising instead of hiring 35 additional staff members.”

    What makes you think they’re not doing both?

  17. Be Rational

    All indications are that they have run no paid Major Network Broadcast TV ads and have no intention of doing so in any of the early ad windows that have come and gone. Ads have to be purchased and run early to earn the free media needed to rise beyond 15%.

    They may hope and pray to run ads before election day in November – if they have enough money. But if you spend your money on other things in life, then you never reach the point when you “have enough money.”

    It’s the same as investing. You have to take risks. You have to actually save your money and actually invest it.

    Campaigns have to preserve campaign funds and then invest them in targeted outreach.

  18. Be Rational

    “Have hired 35 new staff plus 40 full time volunteers.”
    Joseph Buchman
    July 17, 2016 at 12:39

    From Buchman’s summation of Nielson’s report at this NATCOM meeting.

  19. Chuck Moulton

    Joseph Buchman wrote:

    Wondering if anyone is following this BLOG.

    I just got back from family stuff. I’ll be watching the rest of the meeting.

    Thanks very much for your liveblogging, Joe! It’s very helpful to me catching the things I missed.

  20. George Phillies


    poll aggregation via

    Poll Date Sample MoE Trump (R) Clinton (D) Johnson (L) Stein (G)
    UtahPolicy/Dan Jones 6/8 – 6/17 614 RV 4.0 36 27 10 2

    That’s the only 4-way.

  21. Joseph Buchman

    12:20 Executive session and brief recess over.

    Report from Lauren re: her work on branding, special projects, Issues with Facebook, donation landing page,

    12:30 Calling the attorney.

  22. Chuck Moulton

    Joseph Buchman wrote:

    Hagan moves to increase the media relations budget from $3k to $10K for a contractor (Rachael Mills) who will handle press releases. Funds to come from administrative expenses. Passes without objection.

    That’s wonderful! Rachel is great. She worked in Ron Paul’s congressional office and for the Sean Haugh for U.S. Senate campaign a few years ago.

  23. Joseph Buchman

    Joint operating and joint fundraising agreements currently being negotiated and hope for agreement within the next 24 hours or so.

    New Instagram account is online.

    Lawsuits — Constitution Party of Pennsylvania obtained an order granting relief. Lower signature requirements for all parties. Fantastic win. Will remain in effect until the legislature acts (if it so chooses). Fixes last 10 years of issues.

    Another big win in Maine. Now more time to register new members, and has been done now. Now ballot qualified!

    open to Q&A now.

  24. Joseph Buchman

    Aaron Starr asks about the CPD suit.

    It is likely that there will be no decision in time to benefit the campaign in this election cycle. Is at the motion to dismiss stage. Even if we prevail there, there is not time to proceed to litigation prior to this year’s election.

    No further questions for counsel.

  25. Joseph Buchman

    Redpath requests 5 minutes to support a ballot measure in Maine for rank choice voting.

    Starchild requests to call into a grass roots activist’s call at 2pm. Chair or Vice chair will step into hall to do that.

    Moving to filling at-large LNC seat. 20 minutes. Passes without objection.

  26. Joseph Buchman

    Bitner nominates Werther.

    Matson nominates Katz.

    Somes nominates Ms. Mears.

    Bilyeu nominates Kendall.

    Nominations closed. Discussing voting process.

  27. Be Rational

    The LNC should not spend money on the Rank Choice voting issue.

    We should focus our funds on Party building, outreach, ballot access and our national campaigns.

    Not all LP members would support such electoral changes in the voting system.

  28. Joseph Buchman

    Candidate statements, 2 minutes each.

    Ms. Werther is presenting her brief vita and her goals for the committee. She currently teaches Andriod ap programming and aps are needed. Angel program for activists. Communications with high schoolers who register as Libertarians when they get their driver’s license permits. Will be a host when the convention comes to New Orleans.

    Mr. Katz – second term as an alternate, service on other committees. The LNC knows his voting record, stand for “letting national be national” and effective board governance. Prior to that had served as a state chair and secretary. Going into law school this fall. Most importantly he is an elected libertarian.

    Ms. Mears – by telephone. Calling from a Gary Johnson campaign stop. Became a Libertarian at the age of 18, heavily involved with the LP of Ohio, then moved to Florida. Started a Libertarian club in the largest retirement club in the US. Involved with the youth caucus. LP is one of her passions in life. Would be a highlight serving on LNC and something she would enjoy. Promises being drama free and working along. Asks for questions.

    Harlos asks Mears why she did not run for LNC At Large at the Convention.

    Was nominated now. Didn’t consider it at the convention.

    Bilyeu speaks on behalf of Kendall. She does not know him well. She has passed along the information which he had sent to her by email earlier.

    Harlos asks Katz why he did not run at the convention.

    Katz responds that he was waiting for waitlist decisions from other law schools. Now that he is moving, it is more difficult to serve his region. Larry Sharpe has expressed interest in filling his position as alternate.

    Voting by signed ballots occurring now.

  29. Joseph Buchman

    Dr. Lark proposes expressing gratitude toward all willing to serve.

    Ballots being counted by the alternates (excluding Mr. Katz) now.

    Staff reports next.

  30. George Phillies

    STaff report, Benedict.

    Josh Katz was elected as an at-large member to replace the dear departed.

  31. Wes Wagner

    Don’t bother targetting Oregon. Johson and weld can’t possibly rebrand themselves far enough to the classical liberal side of things here to actually do anything to move the electoral vote needle.

    They will be lucky to even get the libertarian vote.

  32. Chuck Moulton

    It’s no surprise that Katz was elected. He was much better known and was also the only candidate that talked about how he would help the LNC as it actually works. The things Werther discussed could be done without being on the LNC. Both Wether and Mears talked about what the LNC would do for them rather than what they would do for the LNC. It also didn’t help that Werther’s regional representative pushed 2 candidates. And Harlos’s focus on process rather than qualifications and fit for the LNC didn’t earn many votes for her preferred candidate.

  33. Joseph Buchman

    Wes reports total dues membership of 17,000. Things started turning around in February. New members seem very excited, wanting to volunteer. Focus is on ballot access. Emergencies have happened. New York is an emergency right now. New Hampshire’s deadline is August 10th. Working to get the party into the news and to schedule Arvin and Nick for media interviews. New products on are selling like crazy.

    (Ed Note – go to buy now)

    565 downticket candidates are listed at so far.

    Taking questions

  34. George Phillies

    Ballot access has some problems. The LNC appropriated a rather small amount of money last time, and now has gaps.

  35. George Phillies

    Talking about whether or not state party has endorsed a candidate. Some parties do this. Some do not.

  36. Chuck Moulton

    Chuck Moulton wrote:

    Both Wether and Mears

    Oops… I meant “Werther”.

    The one downside of not being an IPR editor anymore is I can’t go back and correct my spelling errors after the fact to make it appear as if I never make mistakes.

  37. Joseph Buchman

    Starchild asks about the criteria for listing on the website –

    1) Defer to the state chairs. Some state chairs do not respond. If they are on the state party website, we list them. When candidate calls and says can’t get on a state’s website because it’s not working, then we list them.

    2) Their contact information, photos and websites are listed. If not, then it’s just the name and office.

    Dr. Lark asks – are you understaffed? What do you need/will you need from us?

    Wes – getting responses to those wishing to volunteer is a challenge.

  38. Joseph Buchman

    Katz asks about renewals.

    Wes – sent a special push prior to the convention. Johnson campaign is bringing in lots of new people. Problem with responding to contacts is then they respond again with even more questions and concerns.

    Discussion of using Larry Sharpe in New York to drive signature gathering.

    Everyone should get 100 door hangers, hang them, then call us for more.

    Population of standing committees is next.

  39. Joseph Buchman

    Starchild moves to postpone population of the non LNC members of the audit committee to allow for more time to publicize the openings.

    Debate occurring now.

  40. Joseph Buchman

    Audit committee results

    Buchman 8

    Carling 5

    Fox 5

    Brown 3

    Buchman elected. Runoff election for second non-LNC member position occurring now.

  41. George Phillies

    The LSLA ExComm voted to appoint

    Leigh LaChine
    Michael Pickens
    George Phillies

    to the Affiliate Support Committee

  42. George Phillies

    Joe, Please tell Alicia who the LSLA appointed to the Affilaite Support Committee.

  43. Joseph Buchman

    Awards, Platform, Bylaws, etc committee population deferred to the December meeting. Efforts to promote openings and seeks candidates discussed.

    (sorry I missed the appointment of the affiliate support committee).

    George Phillies has just emailed in the list of LSLA members (I could not hear the names)

    Chair asks for expressions of interest in serving on the IT committee.

    Website committee is a separate ad hoc committee.

    Moving to standing committee reports.

  44. George Phillies

    Ballot access. NH and NY are challenging. The assertion is that the Libertarian Party of New Hampshire is being viewed as practically defunct.

  45. Joseph Buchman

    M. Presents the audited final numbers. Not substantially different from prior report. No new action on Audit Committee since last LNC meeting. All field work has been completed for the 2015 audit.

    Redpath reporting on Ballot Access committee work. Meetings have been weekly during the petition drive season (over the past few weeks). Overall we are on track for 50 states plus DC.

    There are eight hard states —

    Easy states – Washington (July 23 deadline, 1,600 gross collected, 1,000 valid needed); New Jersey (August 1 deadline) – the curse of an easy drive, only needs 800 valid signatures, should have been done with volunteers, now paying out of state funds for sigs; Iowa has 1,000 gross, needs 1,500; Tennessee is done; Minnesota 2,000 net; Virginia needs 5,000 valid, currently has about 5,000 gross; Rhode Island need 1,000 by Sept 9)

    New York – in contact daily, need 15,000 valid, have 10,000 gross currently. Need about 1,000 sigs a day for the last 18 days of the drive . . .

    Massachusetts is essentially done.

    AUGUST 10 is the BIG DAY. 4 states with deadlines.

    1) Connecticut – Katz reports not being happy with where things stand. 5,400 gross; need more staff to finish by the 10th. Need 7,500 valid. Running about 80 percent valid for most signatures. Connecticut is 8 days after New York, so signature gathers will show up from NY for last 8 days.

    2) New Hampshire – almost no effort has occurred in New York since the Orlando convention. Sarwark reports that New Hampshire is starting late from a dead stop. This is the HAIR ON FIRE emergency right now in the chair’s opinion. There is an Independent candidate running for Senate, with a petition that confused things a bit. Some signature gathers for other petitions were reporting getting $7.00 per signature. Problem is avoiding risking cannibalizing other drives with August 10th deadlines. Johnson campaign is sending Chris Thrasher. Need 1,500 per district; 3 districts, 4,500 total. So far 138 total sigs have been collected.

    3) Ohio. Validity is bad in Ohio but getting better. Emphasis was on a party petition (30,000 sigs) which we did not have resources to do. LNC decided to go with an Independent petition (5,000 sigs). New people are coming in with higher validity.

    4) DC – 1,150 gross; petitioning in DC is harder than anywhere else Redpath has petitioned personally. Bill will have gathered over 2,000 sigs as a volunteer personally in five or so states plus DC this year. DC petitions are difficult due to earbuds, walking distracted in DC.

    5) Alabama. Paul Frankl reports they may get done early.

    6) Kentucky. 5,000 valid sigs by Sept 9.

    Down to 16 days in New York, 24 days on DC, CT, NH, and Ohio. Time to budget/spend what is needed. Chair/executive director authorization is needed, may not have time for executive committee to meet to approve funds.

    Starr asks how much more money is needed.

    Redpath — about $100,000.

    Matson – Nielson reported they had $100K to spend on ballot access, time to ask for it!

    Discussion of legalities involved.

  46. Joseph Buchman

    Hayes moves to amend to $340,000. Hagan seconds.

    Hayes speaks in favor — states where the Johnson/Weld campaign gets votes may become states where permanent future ballot access is achieved.

    Redpath – I guarantee that not one more penny will be spent that does not have to be spent going forward.

  47. Andy

    The reason the validity is bad in Ohio is because they are paying non-libertarian mercenary jabronies to gather the signatures instead of having real, proven Libertarian petition circulators/field representatives gathering the signatures.

    Note that i had no validity problems when I gathered petition signatures in Ohio, and the same goes with the neighboring states of Pennsylvania, Kentucky, and Indiana.

    Also, note that the LNC voted to allocate money for Ohio back on April 27th. This is a small drive that only needs 5,000 valid signatures. It is now July 17th and the petition is still not finished. It should have been successfully completed weeks ago.

  48. Joseph Buchman

    LNC Chair is authorized to spend up to $50K for emergency expenditures for ballot access without being subject to executive committee meeting authorization. Motion passes without objection.

    Also without objection $7,500 is authorized to be paid to the LP of Illinois.

    Now checking on Massachusetts and/or Pennsylvania for any urgent payments (none needed).

    Next up . . . EPCC

  49. Starchild

    Here are some details reported by Ron Neilson (Gary Johnson’s campaign manager) earlier in the LNC meeting:

    • CNN polled 13% for Johnson this morning [applause in meeting]; an online poll conducted in Utah has Johnson at 54% (online polls unreliable, but 35,000 people voted; campaign didn’t even know about it in advance so didn’t promote it);
    • Johnson is polling 2nd with millenials and independents;
    • Campaign goals : Get 15% by Labor Day (after then is when the polls that determine who participates in the debates occur)

  50. Starchild

    • Both Johnson and Weld will be in Cleveland next week for about 2 days (Chris Matthews, other big media interviews lined up); they can’t go into convention, but media will come out to interview them; look to go to Philadelphia for Democrat convention also; first states being looked at are generally Dem states (Nevada, New Mexico, Colorado, Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont, possibly Oregon, Iowa);
    • We’ll make this plan public and post it on the website; we want everyone to know what our target states are;
    • Jesse Ventura endorsed Johnson early this week; his home state of Minnesota may become a target
    • Right now focusing on Democrat-leaning states, but Utah, Idaho, Alaska, Wyoming, Montana, and the Dakotas are to be targeted Republican states

  51. Joseph Buchman

    Sorry guys,

    I have been posting the live blog without updating my screen to see the other comments and requests that folks have made of me here. Just saw Dr. Phillies’ request. I believe you must have emailed Ms. Mattson directly as she read those names into the record some hours ago.


  52. Starchild

    I tried to get the LNC to have the Ballot Access Committee publicly post its procedures for hiring and decision-making about petition drives, which help raise discussion of what those procedures should be. I agree with Andy that we should give precedence to libertarians except when it’s very time-sensitive or we just need “any warm-blooded petitioners” to quote one of Bill Redpath’s comments.

  53. Starchild

    Now on item of modifying general counsel retainer agreement. Nick says doesn’t need to be done in secret meeting – that’s a good thing. Says counsel (Oliver Hall) usually works 12 hours a month for $3000 a month. Nick says lately he’s been doing a lot more hours for us at the same cost, but recently told Nick that this is an untenable situation.

  54. Starchild

    Lately he’s been doing 15-20 hours a week, according to Nick. Reviews multiple contracts each week, gives advice to state party affiliates, etc.

  55. Starchild

    Nick is proposing to accede to Hall’s request to pay him $4500 per month but increase his formal hours to match the work he’s doing. I said I have no issues with Hall or his work, but we should always put stuff like this out for competitive bidding.

  56. Joseph Buchman

    Proposal to increase funding (and hourly per month commitment) with counsel.

    Starchild recommends putting the agreement up for competitive bidding.

    Starr asks for the term (length) of the agreement.

    Sarwark reports that the LNC had a search for new legal counsel in the last term. The retainer is indefinite/month-to-month with either a 30 or 60 day notice.

    Starr asks if in non-election years, this would be revised.

    Sarwark responds that it is unlikely to go back to the way things used to be. We are bigger and too many people are after us now.

  57. Joseph Buchman

    Harlos speaks to need to retain party history/update LPedia, (Transfer of LPedia to LSLA on agenda.)

    Dr. Lark speaks against the motion. Would like to see the proposed agreement first.

    Starr expresses concerns about giving away an asset re FEC rules.

  58. Joseph Buchman

    Regional reports. Chair informs LNC that it is assumed that everyone has read the previously submitted written reports (Harlos’s was 42 pages).

    Region One – personally spoke to each chair. Chairs reported generally being pleased with phone calls rather than emails only (after an initial period of shock early in the calls). Arizona is facing an onerous ballot access requirement. Suggests members at least read that section of her report. Received positive feedback from the Johnson Campaign regional director. Listen without discounting what people have to say. Need to reward those states that get ballot access on their own and/or have it.

  59. Joseph Buchman

    Region Two – report is 1/2 of one page. Everyone can read it. More detail from the states can be found in LP news. Florida is having a primary for US Senate.

  60. Joseph Buchman

    Region 4. Can’t access the report due to virus on his phone (“Where is McAfee when you really need him?!?!) Lots of excitement in California. Gained 7.2 percent of the vote with only $13,000. State office is moving from Sacramento. Politicon was a few weeks ago. Governor Johnson appeared there. State fair is coming up. Mark Hinkle reports on state fair (July 8 to 24). Legalize it T-shirts are going like hotcakes. Photos are up on Facebook. Seeing a lot of reactivation of Libertarians from the past.

  61. Joseph Buchman

    Region 5. Dr. Lark reports being increasingly asked to be on RTTV — (Russian).

    Region 6. Excited by Illinois ballot access success. Nebraska is now the first state with a Libertarian state senator (albeit a unicameral legislature).

    Region 7. Arkansas waiting for a lawsuit decision on candidates being chosen after the state’s deadline. Sarwark reports that BAN is reporting that the order has been issued. They have reportedly struck it down, but the court did not add candidates for this cycle. Texas loves nationbuilder.

  62. Joseph Buchman

    Dr. Lark asks about the Texit movement (succession).

    A Texit related plank has been left in the LP Texas platform.

    Region 8. Home of the most intense ballot access and litigation.

    Moving to New Business without previous notice. Mr. Hagan on a proposal to support Mr. Moore.

    Asks for donations of up to $10K. Notes that he also has a PAC.

    Move that the LNC donate $10K to Moore for Assembly.

  63. George Phillies

    They are comparing Moore and Coleman. The LNC was told that Coleman was an iincumbent running for re-election. He was not. He moved from being an at-large to running in a district.

    Joe, please ask the LNC to give the legal limit to Thom Simmons, MA CD – 1, who spoke at NatCon.

  64. Joseph Buchman

    Redpath speaks in opposition. Past experience has not been good. Urges the committee to vote no.

    Vohra amplifies Redpath’s remarks.

    Harlos spending money on candidates in winnable or high profile races is a good idea. Not sure if this race is the first that should be supported this year. Other candidates could be closer to winning.

    Katz – opposes the motion but generally supports the idea. Is concerned about the precedent of supporting former Rs or Ds who win, then switch. Will we attract more of that? If we are going to do this, then let’s set up a structure to research all candidates.

    Hewitt – This is a rare opportunity. He is the incumbent. Nice guy. Will make national news if he pulls this off — millions of dollars in exposure.

    Bittner – can provide insight as someone who has won reelection as a Libertarian. He has switched based on principle, not for pragmatic reasons (as in Georgia where Ds switched to Rs as the state turned Red).

    Lark – Is there a written proposal?

    Sarwark – no

    Lark – when requesting money from the LNC, a written proposal with more information would be helpful.

    Starchild – we need a crowdfunding effort to let our donors choose.

    Vhora – is that legal?

    Sarwark – raising money for state candidates by a national organization has difficult rules to follow to avoid illegality. We can give money to state parties without much in the way of legal concerns.

    Marsh – has the state of nevada lp donates?

    Hagan – no we only have $500 or so in the state party treasury.

    Marsh – I think we should step out and do this, he has raised $56,000. Chris Rufer funded at $40K. There has been no ballot access money spent in Nevada.

    Hayes – Mr. Moore spoke at the Louisiana state convention. $2,500 was raised for Mr. Moore. It is time to start showing support to targeted campaigns.

  65. George Phillies

    LNC can use Federal funds to do Get Out the Vote, and that must be done with Federal funds, once you are close to the election.

  66. George Phillies

    There is a straightforward legal path to supporting the campaign with LNC Federal funds.

  67. Joseph Buchman

    Bilyeu – the word “Libertarian” does not appear on his election website.

    Sarwark – I have talked to other legislators who are considering switching to Libertarian. One of the questions asked of me is, “Is there any support for me if I do this?” I have never, ever promised money. There is a signal that is made when the party stands with someone who takes this kind of risk. We want more of those. I will vote yes to this motion.

    Vote taking place now.

  68. Joseph Buchman

    Vhora moves to approve Rhode Island’s request for $1,000 to support outreach events at which signature gathering and other outreach efforts will take place.

    Discussion of process for vetting such requests going on now.

  69. Joseph Buchman

    Motion to refer the Rhode Island request to affiliate support committee passes by “alot to nothing” (quote from Chair Sarwark). Starchild abstained. I believe all other members voted yes.

    Katz moves to amend the agenda to add after the log cabin republicans a request from the LP of Massachusetts. Motion fails.

    Chair suggests members consider the possibility of a motion to create a committee to consider these sorts of requests.

  70. Joseph Buchman

    Katz moves to (among other things with a longer preamble than I could capture) prohibit statements from POTUS and VPOTUS candidates that are contradictory to the platform.

    Harlos objects, protects the brand over protecting our candidates

    Matson speaks in favor. There is a fight between political reality and how you sell incremental steps to new libertarians verses our ultimate goals. To get a foot in the door, the Johnson/Weld campaign has a strategy to get short-term improvements. We cannot sell the American Public on our end game upfront.

    Vhora – disagrees with Matson. Our end game is not to lower the income tax by 1 percent, but I would say that a proposal to lower any tax by 1 percent IS in alignment with our platform. If we discuss revenue neutral proposals, that is not in alignment with our platform. Any tiny step in the correct direction is in alignment with the platform.

    Motion fails 4 to 7. (with several abstentions).

    Outreach to log cabin republicans is next.

    Harlos asks to amend the agenda to schedule 10 minutes to increase the affiliate support line item, and authorize the committee to spend it.

    Motion passes

  71. George Phillies

    Thanks to Josh for forwarding our request.

    Simmons is a Libertarian. Simmons4Congress can use support.

  72. Joseph Buchman

    Harlos presents request from a regional member that we reach out to the log cabin republicans due to the religiosity currently being proposed for this year’s GOP platform.

    Motion to refer this to the Chair to reach out to the Log Cabin Republicans passes without objection.

    Motion to fund the affiliate support committee with an additional $10,000

  73. Joseph Buchman

    Affiliate support committee chair promises to quickly develop and publicize criteria for evaluating requests for support. Mentions that Dr. Phillies is on the committee and has a commitment to transparency.

    Lark asks “From what pot of money is this being transferred?”

    Sarwark – comes from revenue being way up.

    Vhora – Will probably vote against the motion. In the past term the Affiliate support committee had spending recommendations that were simply bad. Had that money been spent without LNC oversight, it would have been not good.

    Marsh – Is there a reason this isn’t coming out of the outreach budget line?

    Hagan – most of that line item has been spent. Only about $500 left in there.

    Motion to increase affiliate support committee budget by $10,000 and give them the authority to spend it passes 9 to 3 with 3 abstentions.

    Discussion of goals are next. It is 6:21. We have the room until 7PM.

    Vhora moves to amend the agenda for five minutes of discussion of moving ownership of one of our facebook pages.

  74. Joseph Buchman

    Motion passes.

    Vhora moves to transfer ownership of the youth-oriented facebook page to the youth caucus. Somes speaks in favor.

    Vhora explains that the page is not technically/formally the property of the Libertarian party, but that he as control over the page.

    Harlos, if it is not our property, we have no authority.

    Mattson states agreement with Harlos.

    Lark asks that the motion be withdrawn from consideration at this time.

    Motion withdrawn without objection.

  75. George Phillies

    Goals as opposed to steps to move in the right direction are a waste of time.

  76. George Phillies

    Now an LNC member is advocating for proportional representation. This leads to massive corruption. It also makes it far harder to get the legislative majority we need to advance.

  77. Joseph Buchman

    Dr. Lark begins goals discussion.

    Each goal needs a champion who can report on the movement toward the goal.

    Vhora – proposes two goals 1) heavy increase in outreach to major traditional media; social media is becoming saturated and expensive; and 2) a more organized speakers bureau.

    Redpath – would like to see the LP involved in the movement for proportional representation. Identifies this as the root cause of a two-party system.

    Harlos – proposes a goals meeting via teleconference.

    Katz – asks what will we do with these goals — self assessment? reelection? budgeting? bonuses? Also asks for an online meeting prior to the election

    Starchild – transparency is a goal. Set a model for governance. Realizing that power corrupts and being vigilant for that. Too much of the goal conversation is driven by PR and looking good.

    Starr – Doesn’t think our past goals have been for PR reasons. The purpose of goals is to change our current and future behavior. Goals are outputs, so you need inputs. For example, membership should be at X number, that’s not meaningful without a path to doing it (perhaps direct mail, managed by these people, at this cost, and so on . . ..). If all we do is say we have these laudable goals without a path, then we will have nothing to show for it. Wants to stop repeating this process over and over again. Someone needs to own the goal and have a plan with deadlines. Committee owned goals mean nothing.

    Lark – I am pleased with the conversation. One thing that is sometimes overlooked is thinking through what is important. You must look at various possible outcomes and choose which is most important, and what resources will be required. Keeping in mind that there is no such thing as THE Libertarian Party — there are a whole bunch of them.

    Hewitt moves to close the discussion. No objection. Discussion to continue online/by telephone.

    Announcements are next.

  78. Joseph Buchman

    Hayes – reads email from Mr. Moore expressing his gratitude for the donation to his campaign.

    Harlos asks we communicate our support and request that he add the word LIBERTARIAN to his election website.

    Carling thanks the LNC for giving more authority to the affiliate support committee.

    Lark – expresses gratitude to the other libertarians and others who attended the meeting.

    Sarwark – reads statement from Gary Johnson about the murders of three law enforcement officers earlier today in Baton Rouge.

    short executive committee meeting is next.

  79. Joseph Buchman

    IPR will not continue to BLOG the executive committee meeting (taking Caryn and Daniel to the airport). This is not in executive session so Livestream will continue.

  80. Mark Axinn

    Thanks to Joe and everyone else who reported above.

    Best line by far: “Where is McAfee when you really need him?!?!”

  81. Caryn Ann Harlos

    The most important motion that failed with long term ideological effects was Katz’s motion. I think Joe’s statement might be misconstrued as to what I said. I objected – vociferously- that at no time should we put protecting our candidate’s over protecting our brand. I believe Katz’ motion was a back door way to bind the judgment of the APRC to his particular view of our platform rather than the stated purpose of the motion of treating our candidates with good faith. I argued that good faith should be presumed- that it is the duty of the LNC – in their functions as LNC members and committee members – to treat our candidates with good faith within their judgment of our fiduciary duty to the Party and anyone who could not do that should not be on the LNC.

    I said all this at the meeting. Due to the confidential nature of the APRC I could say no further.

    That was IMHO an inappropriate power move.

  82. Caryn Ann Harlos

    Another big theme of my advocacy was that national needs to be supporting the affiliates- all of the affiliates. There are states- notably nearly every state in my region – that doesn’t need help with ballot access. These states get virtually no assistance from national (the services of the awesome Andy Burns is a shining exception) and there are other targeted ways of assisting those states. Right or wrong there is some resentment from
    states that get no love and little support.

  83. Losty

    Mr. Buchman at 20:04

    Matson speaks in favor. There is a fight between political reality and how you sell incremental steps to new libertarians verses our ultimate goals. To get a foot in the door, the Johnson/Weld campaign has a strategy to get short-term improvements. We cannot sell the American Public on our end game upfront.

    That Last Line. Was that actually said?

    If the American people can’t “Be sold” on the end game of the Party, that leads to a question I am not sure many want asked.

    Regardless of whether you like every goal of the party, or just some.
    Regardless actually of whatever party you would be saying that about…

    That is a scary line come tithing of it, isn’t it…

    Would there be anything worth rethinking?

  84. Be Rational

    “1) Connecticut – Katz reports not being happy with where things stand. 5,400 gross; need more staff to finish by the 10th. Need 7,500 valid. Running about 80 percent valid for most signatures. Connecticut is 8 days after New York, so signature gathers will show up from NY for last 8 days.”

    You should not count on more than 50% validity in CT.

    To be safe, you should file at least 15,000 gross for 7,500 valid. Don’t skimp. Better to overkill in CT.

    The LP has failed the POTUS ballot drive in CT on several occasions because they filed too few signatures. They counted on a high validity rate that didn’t materialize.

  85. Caryn Ann Harlos

    That was said and I was deeply disturbed by it though I think what Mattson meant was not exactly how it came out. I believe she was engaging in the fallacy of “all or nothing” which is not something that the more radical of us believe. It is a false image that just won’t die. However if we hide our end goals – that is dishonest and horridly harmful to creating a “world set free in our lifetimes.” People aren’t stupid, they will realize when they are sold a bill of goods. i think her comments came dangerously close to “we should never try to sell our end game” rather than “we need to move policy in a libertarian direction”- I deny that we can do that if we don’t clearly say what the goal of that direction is. And we know it- it is our statement of principles. If we hide that or bury that we are contrary to our Party’s charter- and I do believe, whether consciously or not, there is a inclination to bury our Statement of Principles. I will never concede to that. However, I do think that the way it came out can lead to much more uncharitable interpretation than what she intended, from my perspective of being there at the meeting.

    I believe Vohra responded to this very deftly and on point by pointing out that people DO respond to consistent stating of end goals and that any increments have to be real ones that actually do move policy, even if only slightly in an actual libertarian direction, not just shift government from here to there.

  86. losty


    If you can’t sell the American People on the end goals, you may need to question the end goals in the first place.

  87. George Phillies

    “Joseph Buchman
    July 17, 2016 at 19:54
    Katz moves to amend the agenda to add after the log cabin republicans a request from the LP of Massachusetts [GP: for a maximum legal contribution to the Simmons4Congress Campaign.]

    Simmons got two short speaking slots at the 2016 NatCon, and was cheered.

    The astute reader will note that I was the only state chair to notice that the LNC was funding individual candidates, and make sure that my state’s leading Federal candidate got a cut of the available funds.

  88. Starchild

    This LNC meeting featured a number of requests for money from candidates and affiliates. Although all of them sounded potentially worthy, I continue to be concerned that we effectively take up these proposals on an ad hoc basis without any solid effort to guarantee fairness or consistency in how funds are allocated, and therefore decided to either abstain or vote no on each in the hopes that we will adopt a better approach.

    As Joe Buchman briefly noted in his live blogging, I again brought up crowdfunding as a way to address this problem, as well as bring in more money. Under such an approach, the LNC could approve any project (request for funding) that met minimum standards (in accord with libertarian principles, has a sponsor able to answer questions about the project, spending would be transparent and accountable, etc.) Approved projects could then be listed on a web page on informing prospective donors as to:

    • How much money is being sought
    • What is the time frame for raising the money
    • How much has been raised so far
    • Who to contact with further questions
    • What guarantees are in place that the funds will be spent as promised
    • Conditions under which donations will be refunded, if any

    Emails and direct mail sent out by the party, rather than hustling people for money, could simply update recipients on the status of projects currently listed on the crowdfunding page, and encourage folks to visit the page and donate to the project(s) of their choice.

    By having a number of projects presented side by side, I think prospective donors would be in a better position to make comparisons and decide which would make the best use of their funds to advance the cause of freedom. When projects come before the LNC, we typically consider them independently one at a time and do not have such a ready means of comparing various funding needs. Historically, I think the LNC has tended to favor those projects whose backers are known to us. That might still happen with people visiting a crowdfunding website being more likely to favor projects backed by people familiar to them, but in that case it would not be a matter of having relationships with a small number of people in the party leadership.

    I believe crowdfunding would not only allow us to raise more money – increasing the number of choices makes it more likely that any given donor will see one that appeals to him or her – but also allow more effective use of the party’s funds. Instead of being spent directly on projects pitched to us, the LNC could use the funds at our disposal as “matching funds” to encourage people to donate to projects on the crowdfunding site, e.g. for every dollar donated to a project, the LNC would kick in an additional $.10, or whatever amount seemed reasonable during a given time period in consideration of current budgetary constraints. In this way, we would be relying on the “wisdom of crowds” (i.e. the party’s membership/donor base) in allocating funds, rather than making less well informed and more arbitrary decisions influenced by our limited personal knowledge.

    If you like this idea, please lobby your LNC representatives to support it! Your ideas, suggestions, feedback, etc., is also welcome – please feel free to get in touch with me any time.

    Love & Liberty,
    ((( starchild )))
    At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
    (415) 625-FREE

  89. Caryn Ann Harlos

    I am very sympathetic to Starchild’s idea but hesitant to jump abruptly from one thing to another. And I don’t think we are talking an either/or. Perhaps a committee- such as the affiliate support committee – can road test this.

    I am pleased we empowered committees and that Daniel Hayes committed to transparency with affiliate support. I am uneasy that empowering committees will lead to less transparency and plan on suggesting a policy manual change on that.

  90. Starchild

    Caryn – Right on regarding the LNC Policy Manual change to address committee transparency. Let’s talk about that.

    As for “jump(ing) abruptly from one thing to another”, I’m comfortable simply advocating full steam ahead with the crowdfunding idea, just as I am comfortable speaking without qualification in favor of immediately adopting libertarian policies such as voluntary taxation, in the knowledge that others will inevitably insist on a more hesitant or gradual approach, whether we radicals also embrace gradualism or not. Not that I would recommend going slowly in any case when I believe a policy is good and see no reasons not to proceed, but I recognize the reality that those less bold will generally apply the brakes anyway without me needing to do so.

    Anyway, it’s not exactly as if crowdfunding is a new idea that’s never been road-tested at this point. It is in fact a proven industry which is being used to successfully raise tens of billions of dollars a year for all different kinds of causes, from real estate to startups to political projects:

    If anyone has reasons why this success is allegedly not adaptable to the Libertarian Party’s needs, I’d like to hear them.

  91. Caryn Ann Harlos Post author

    Starchild, I am just not convinced yet that the crowdfunding will work for us, and a test run with a committee, such as Affiliate Support, would help prove it to me (but more importantly, everyone else).

    I thought you would like my thoughts on the transparency policy manual change, and I will be introducing it for discussion soon. I caught some terrible bug in Vegas and am down for the count for a little while.

    I want us to empower these committees, but this will lose a lot of transparency ground without such a policy manual change.

  92. Starchild

    Sorry to hear you got sick in Vegas, Caryn. I’m certainly open to hearing what you have in mind with a “test run” of crowdfunding using a committee like Affiliate Support, but am having trouble envisioning how it would be limited in scope while still constituting a legitimate test run of the crowdfunding approach. Simply turning funding decisions over to a committee is not crowdfunding. If such a sub-committee were empowered to offer party members and others the ability to contribute directly to the projects delegated to them by the LNC, the key would be how well the program was publicized. If the opportunity to choose among projects to fund isn’t brought to the attention of members and donors, it won’t attract the “crowds” that are a key element of crowdfunding.

  93. Caryn Ann Harlos

    Starchild, right now for me, my focus is to get committees empowered to actually do something. BUT, that adds a layer of opacity that I do not care for, so I believe I am going to concentrate on asking for a policy manual change that requires committees to be more transparent unless their specific duties say otherwise (like the APRC – and I am slowly coming around to the idea that I do think the APRC should be confidential).

    I would like to see crowd funding trials done AFTER we have certain transparencies in place.

    I think a transparency provision in the PM is something we have in common to support.

  94. Starchild

    Caryn – I’m more than fine with getting transparency language added to the Policy Manual (and getting functional committees that actually do stuff). Both these steps would be worthy goals for the LNC in my opinion (when we discuss goals).

    My preference is for keeping all sub-committee matters fully open and transparent including the Advertising & Publications Review Committee (APRC). If a matter is important enough to be kept secret, then I’d say it’s important enough that it should come to the attention of the full Libertarian National Committee.

    But if the APRC ends up keeping secrets, let’s have some safeguards: A public roll call vote on each specific piece of advertising or content for which the committee wants to keep the correspondence secret, and a sunset clause on the term of that secrecy.

  95. Caryn Ann Harlos

    Hi Starchild, with the APRC, it just doesn’t work like that – but just letting you know, for me, that is a back burner item, and I will be focusing on a general PM change suggestion for transparency. It is a good start.

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