February 2019 Open Thread

Our belatedly late monthly open thread. Post news tips about alt parties and independent candidates, discuss any story that should be posted here but has not yet been posted, or even delve into completely off-topic stuff. And remember kiddies, conservatives are commies.

92 thoughts on “February 2019 Open Thread

  1. dL Post author

    America will never be a socialist country. But with Jesus’ help to build the wall, it surely will be a communist one.

  2. dL Post author

    Whatever it takes (short of shipping pallets of US fiat currency to NK) to end the Korean War and bring our troops home.

    The Korean war ended in 1953. I’m pretty sure all takes to end the US troop presence in South Korea is for the so-called commander and chief to command the troops to leave.

  3. Krzysztof Lesiak

    Sam Sedar has formed a totally non-ironic exploratory committee to seek the LP’s presidential nomination, according to Wikipedia.

    Has the Libertarian Socialist Caucus found its ideal candidate?

    Here’s the January 24th video where he makes the announcement:

  4. dL Post author

    Sam Sedar has formed a totally non-ironic exploratory committee to seek the LP’s presidential nomination, according to Wikipedia.

    Oh, it would be ironic. Isn’t that that the dude that had the run-in with Darryl Perry?

  5. SocraticGadfly

    Sorry for the reposts!

    My computer and/or WordPress were being wonky earlier, and though it said I had “already posted that” is wasn’t showing up.

    Related … two posts back?

    No, I don’t think the GP is irrelevant. Its Green New Deal is not AOC’s.

    That said, if the antivaxxers get full control of the party, it IS irrelevant for me.

  6. dL Post author

    Don’t confuse dL with facts. He is very ignorant.

    Example: “commander and chief”

    yep, Trumpists

  7. William T. Forrest

    “Oh, it would be ironic. Isn’t that that the dude that had the run-in with Darryl Perry?”

    Yes.

  8. paulie

    My computer and/or WordPress were being wonky earlier, and though it said I had “already posted that” is wasn’t showing up.

    That’s not your fault, it’s a technical glitch we are having at IPR, discussed in last month’s open thread and some other threads.

  9. Just Some Random Guy

    @dL

    The Korean war ended in 1953.

    The war actually hasn’t *technically* ended, as no peace treaty has ever been made. We’ve just been in a period of frozen conflict since then.

  10. dL Post author

    “Oh, it would be ironic. Isn’t that that the dude that had the run-in with Darryl Perry?”

    Yes.

    It’s a joke. If by some remote chance it is not a joke, it’s an attempt by Seder to finagle his way into a debate to try to embarrass the Libertarian Party.

  11. dL Post author

    The war actually hasn’t *technically* ended, as no peace treaty has ever been made. We’ve just been in a period of frozen conflict since then.

    Well, if you want to be “technical,” technically, it was never a war; it was a United Nations police action. The fighting ended in 1953 with a signed armistice. Not once in my lifetime have I ever heard the Korean War, the so-called “forgotten war,” referred to in the present tense until Trump eighth dimensional chess flunkies tried to manufacture a rationale for (1) Trump’s initial North Korea bluster and (2) Trump’s current lavish praise for kim jong un and his state socialist economic system as supposed means to end a war that ended 70 years ago. Now if you want to count the American military presence in South Korea as evidence that the war never ended, fair enough. But the American military is not leaving South Korea, regardless of what new piece of paper may or may not be signed.

  12. paulie

    It’s a joke. If by some remote chance it is not a joke, it’s an attempt by Seder to finagle his way into a debate to try to embarrass the Libertarian Party.

    Agreed.

  13. Thomas Knapp

    Actually, lots of people are having trouble posting and/or seeing comments because of some kind of technical problem that seems to be related to a recent site move.

    I’m not saying none of your posts were deleted, because I don’t know, but I see at least two recent screeds from you. I’m not sure why you think anyone would be afraid of an idiot spamming Jew-baiting BS.

  14. paulie

    I accidentally read his posts just now (I usually skip them) and decided the violate long established community semi-formal guidelines about ethnic/racial crap spam being posted here. I assumed it was the troll/impersonator phenomenon, but it wouldn’t matter if it was the real DJ – even long time IPR regular Andy was kicked out for posting that kind of stuff. It didn’t help his case that he jumped right to the conclusion that he was being censored rather than experiencing a technical problem, as was actually the case. Well, now he is in fact being censored and he can bitch about that to whoever he wants.

  15. paulie

    I should say deplatformed, since censored is a thing governments do. Anyway, he’s still welcome to post here for now, but not that crap. If he makes a habit of posting that kind of garbage someone please alert me to that and then he won’t be welcome at all.

  16. paulie

    I always feel free, and have at least a hundred articles I am behind on posting, I just can’t always summon the motivation. Lately, it’s the site migration related technical problems that are sapping my enthusiasm and I’m also busy with multiple work and volunteer projects. I really need help from people willing to post some of these articles. Being behind on posting anything here is kind of self-perpetuating because I feel like if I post anything I need to post all the other things I have been wanting to and promising people to post and then more come at me as I’m doing it. So what I really need is some people who are also posting articles, that usually inspires me to join them. That and getting the comment issues fixed.

  17. Krzysztof Lesiak

    Jesus fucking Christ:

    But it was not deleted and replaced fast enough to stop the Iranian foreign minister from grabbing a screenshot and slamming Netanyahu. Mohammad Javad Zarif also repeated his criticism of the U.S.-organized event using the hashtag: #WarsawCircus.

    Bibi the Bringer of Peace: “What is important about this meeting, and it is not in secret, because there are many of those – is that this is an open meeting with representatives of leading Arab countries, that are sitting down with Israel in order to advance our common interest of war with Iran.”

    https://www.politico.eu/article/ahead-of-peace-meeting-in-warsaw-netanyahu-threatens-war-with-iran/

    Hopefully, not a single commentator on IPR believes that this tweet is a good thing.

  18. wredlich

    Krzysztof, let me get this straight. For about 40 years Iran has been threatening to destroy Israel. No retractions, no edits, no apologies. That doesn’t bother you.

    The Israeli prime minister tweets something about war with Iran, then “corrects” it, and this is somehow a crisis?

  19. Jim

    Getting 1% in three separate polls or, alternatively, receiving donations from 65,000 donors nationwide and 200 donors from 20 states gets a candidate in the Democratic Primary debates. No ideological test, but there is a limit of 20 candidates. If more than 20 qualify, the candidates who meet both criteria will be prioritized, followed by polling data.

    The debates will be split into 2 consecutive nights, with candidates being randomly assigned to one or the other night.

  20. Anthony Dlugos

    Stabbed in the back?

    We walked away from the 2016 presidential election in the best position ballot-access wise than we ever have.

    Try to keep up with…events, current or otherwise.

  21. paulie

    We walked away from the 2016 presidential election in the best position ballot-access wise than we ever have.

    That may be because of or it may despite Weld being on the ticket, and it doesn’t tell us whether a relatively minor improvement in ballot access position (much of us which was due to state by state legal changes in the preceding years, not anything the presidential ticket did or did not do) was worth whatever damage he may have done to the party either by being associated with it in the first place, going back to the Republicans, or both.

    It’s a fact that he stabbed the party in the back by going back to the Republicans after getting the nomination only due to promising to never do that. It’s besides the point that you think delegates were foolish to extract such a promise, or that we both think they were foolish to believe his answer. For some delegates their vote was based on it and they feel betrayed. Others who promoted him and tied their personal credibility to him only because he was in the LP and promised to stay with the LP feel betrayed. It doesn’t matter that some of us believe the LP is better off without him, it still cements our reputation as NSGOP Jr when we nominate yet another recent Republican who soon thereafter goes back to the Republicans. Yes, it’s a betrayal, and any mitigating factors are only a matter of opinion. Even if you think he did a lot for the LP (I don’t) it’s still a betrayal nevertheless.

  22. Think About It

    McAfee states that if Bitcoin doesn’t go past $1,000,000 by 2020 he’ll eat his own member.

    I say: bone appétit !

  23. dL Post author

    We walked away from the 2016 presidential election in the best position ballot-access wise than we ever have.

    Ok, then, thank him for his service, and wish him luck in the Republican party, but his 2020 LP run is over.

  24. paulie

    Orange man is bad

    Yep, pretty much. Succinct and to the point.

    Bad doesn’t begin to describe it. Impeach, remove, and lock him up.

  25. paulie

    Via FB:

    Brian W. Ryman

    To Save our Republic the President Must be Impeached!

    Anyone who knows me or has simply glanced at my posts on occasion knows of my antipathy towards Trump. I despise his authoritarian populism, his undermining of the free market, his personal immorality, his penchant for lying and overall boorishness – and I have not been shy about letting others know of contempt for the man.

    Despite his occasional pretense of non-interventionism and his tepid calls for deregulation, I have called into question the political and philosophical leanings of anyone that would even tentatively back a man of such low character. But… I have never called for his impeachment… before yesterday when he made a full assault on the Constitutional concepts of separations of powers and the power of the purse resting solely in the hands of Congress-specifically the House.

    I do not think that calls for impeachment should be done lightly and am not taking up the shrill reactionary cries of others, like Maxine Waters who started chanting the mantra “Impeach Trump” before there were Constitutional grounds to do so. With his actions yesterday, the grounds on which to impeach him became solid enough to build a New York high-rise on. In case you think that I am just suffering from Trump derangement syndrome, I recommend that you search my posts during Obama’s administration where I continually called for Obama’s impeachment for similar violations of the Constitution in his egregious bombing of Libya when there was no clear and present danger from it. Obama was given a pass because his violations of the War Powers Act of 1973 were within the supposed purview of international affairs- a realm in which the chief executive is given extra-constitutional latitude. Trump’s indiscretions, on the other hand, strike us here at home and are related to the “power of the purse” and should be abhorrent to anyone that cares about constraints of state power.

    Why is the power of the purse so important and why is it so horrid that Trump, through executive caveat, seeks to undermine it?
    As James Madison said in Federalist 55, “This power over the purse may, in fact, be regarded as the most complete and effectual weapon with which any constitution can arm the immediate representatives of the people, for obtaining a redress of every grievance, and for carrying into effect every just and salutary measure.”
    In circumventing the power over the purse, through emergency declaration, the president has removed “the most complete and effectual weapon with which any constitution can arm the immediate representatives of the people” and has taken on quasi dictatorial powers. To save our republic, the president MUST be impeached.

    Is there a silver lining behind this dark cloud of authority? Only if we make one.
    This usurpation of power should be a galvanizing cry to eliminate the National Emergencies Act of 1976 and ALL other acts that delegate power to the executive branch that should remain in the body that serves as the immediate representative of the people.

    Paulie: Glad you have joined us in calling for impeachment. I have thought Trump has been legitimately impeach and remove worthy for a long time, although I have had the same feelings about every president since at least Bush Sr and without a doubt since Bill Clinton. In general I think impeachments shouldn’

    Paulie: Should not be shied away from so much, in retrospect I would add Reagan and Iran-Contra-Cocaine to the mix.

    Paulie: I agree with all of these https://www.needtoimpeach.com/impeachable-offenses as well as the one you mentioned and I think there are others not even mentioned there.

  26. dL Post author

    Bad doesn’t begin to describe it. Impeach, remove, and lock him up.

    No, the point is don’t take the “WhatAbout” bait. Orange man is bad. Yes, he is.

  27. paulie

    Might help if we knew who the guy was.

    Why? It’s just a comment I responded to on FB. You can look him up if you wish. I think his comment and my response speak for themselves, but do whatever due diligence you feel you need to if any. I did not take up his invitation to look up whatever he was saying in the Obama years, nor do I care.

  28. dL Post author

    I hope that tweet wasn’t actually put out by the LP.

    Obviously, it was…The LNC gets in a tizzy over the Church of Satan facebook post, but not a peep over some knucklehead sending out a fake Donald Trump endorsement on the heels of Trump’s National Emergency declaration.

  29. Carol Moore/Secession.net

    If it was tweeted, not there now. Looks more like the stupider FB posts. Twitter does seem to have better ones.

  30. Roger Roots

    Lots of Trump hate on this thread. Most from Libertarians. Almost all of it is proper and fitting.

    But if one compares Trump to Obama, Bush and Clinton, however, one must conclude Trump is at least no worse than the other 3.

    Trump has actually done a small handful of ‘libertarian’ things:
    1) his mild efforts to cut back against the government’s ‘climate change’ hysteria could be described as libertarian.
    2) Trump’s FCC did overturn Obama’s FCC on “net neutrality,” which was a libertarian reform.
    3) Trump is generally slightly less interventionist (thus far) than any of the prior 3. I’m thinking specifically of Trump’s efforts to curtail or start dismantling NATO and his (seeming, at this moment) withdrawal of U.S. intervention in Syria.
    4) Neil Gorsuch is possibly the most libertarian justice on the Supreme Court in the past generation.

  31. dL Post author

    Lots of Trump hate on this thread. Most from Libertarians. Almost all of it is proper and fitting.

    No. All of it is proper and fitting.

    But if one compares Trump to Obama, Bush and Clinton, however, one must conclude Trump is at least no worse than the other 3.

    Well, if you are going to use the Cato scorecard, then Trump doesn’t hold a candle to Bill Clinton. Budget surpluses, booming economy, generational banking “deregulation,” largely unregulated internet, welfare reform, and a very mild military interventionism compared to today. Personally, I don’t use that standard, but the ones who do seem to apply it solely to finding needles in republican haystacks.

    Neil Gorsuch is possibly the most libertarian justice on the Supreme Court in the past generation.

    The guy who came down on the side of the muslim ban and internet sales taxes? That guy? I don’t think so.

  32. wredlich

    “Neil Gorsuch is possibly the most libertarian justice on the Supreme Court in the past generation.”

    Thomas invoked the Commerce Clause in a footnote to a marijuana case, suggesting he would consider whether the Controlled Substances Act is within the power of the federal government. But no one has taken him up on that in a subsequent case.

  33. wredlich

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gonzales_v._Raich#Dissenting_opinions

    –Justice Thomas also wrote a separate dissent, stating in part:

    Respondents Diane Monson and Angel Raich use marijuana that has never been bought or sold, that has never crossed state lines, and that has had no demonstrable effect on the national market for marijuana. If Congress can regulate this under the Commerce Clause, then it can regulate virtually anything—and the Federal Government is no longer one of limited and enumerated powers.

    Respondent’s local cultivation and consumption of marijuana is not “Commerce … among the several States.”

    […]

    Certainly no evidence from the founding suggests that “commerce” included the mere possession of a good or some personal activity that did not involve trade or exchange for value. In the early days of the Republic, it would have been unthinkable that Congress could prohibit the local cultivation, possession, and consumption of marijuana.

    […]

    If the Federal Government can regulate growing a half-dozen cannabis plants for personal consumption (not because it is interstate commerce, but because it is inextricably bound up with interstate commerce), then Congress’ Article I powers – as expanded by the Necessary and Proper Clause – have no meaningful limits. Whether Congress aims at the possession of drugs, guns, or any number of other items, it may continue to “appropria[te] state police powers under the guise of regulating commerce.”

    […]

    If the majority is to be taken seriously, the Federal Government may now regulate quilting bees, clothes drives, and potluck suppers throughout the 50 States. This makes a mockery of Madison’s assurance to the people of New York that the “powers delegated” to the Federal Government are “few and defined”, while those of the States are “numerous and indefinite.”–

    I don’t know if that’s libertarian but his reasoning would certainly reduce the size and power of the federal government.

  34. dL Post author

    Thomas invoked the Commerce Clause in a footnote to a marijuana case, suggesting he would consider whether the Controlled Substances Act is within the power of the federal government. But no one has taken him up on that in a subsequent case.

    Clarence Thomas? The guy who is in the news for wanting to overturn the New York Times v. Sullivan 1964 libel case?

  35. paulie

    But if one compares Trump to Obama, Bush and Clinton, however, one must conclude Trump is at least no worse than the other 3.

    I think he’s worse than all 3 combined.

  36. Thomas Knapp

    “Trump is generally slightly less interventionist (thus far) than any of the prior 3. I’m thinking specifically of Trump’s efforts to curtail or start dismantling NATO and his (seeming, at this moment) withdrawal of U.S. intervention in Syria.”

    He’s made no “effort to curtail or start dismantling NATO.” He’s flapped his lips about it a few times.

    He put more troops into Syria than were there when he came into office and is now supposedly withdrawing some of them — to Iraq.

  37. Freeman

    a lot o Trump Derangement here. Bush/Cheney was much worse.
    …so far, of course. Ya can’t see the whole thing til it’s in your rearview mirror.

  38. paulie

    There’s no such thing as Trump Derangement except among his rabid followers. There’s also Trump Denial Syndrome or Trump Stockholm Syndrome or Trump Normalization Syndrome, which covers tepid supporters, those who waiver on him and tepid opponents, and even some strong opponents. Duhbya was a piker. The Cheeto Benito shouldn’t be compared to past US presidents but more to foreign autocrats or those who led their nations down that path. Some of you don’t realize it yet but give it time and you will. It will be too late to do anything about it by then.

  39. paulie

    Jess said she recycled the Trump tweet along with many others from 2017.

    Jess Mears @Paulie Cannoli yes, it is recycled from 2017. It did not receive positive feedback on Twitter so I removed the same meme from the FB schedule.

  40. wredlich

    I wrote:
    –Thomas invoked the Commerce Clause in a footnote to a marijuana case, suggesting he would consider whether the Controlled Substances Act is within the power of the federal government. But no one has taken him up on that in a subsequent case.–

    dL wrote: –Clarence Thomas? The guy who is in the news for wanting to overturn the New York Times v. Sullivan 1964 libel case?–

    Yes, that Clarence Thomas. He wrote something that sounded libertarian once, and about a very libertarian issue, the drug war. It was really more federalist than libertarian though.

  41. wredlich

    paulie wrote: “There’s no such thing as Trump Derangement”

    We may have had this conversation on the phone. TDS is real. It became most evident when the Union of Reform Judaism opposed Trump’s recognition of Israel. Also when Democrats opposed bringing troops home from Syria and Afghanistan. Jussie Smollett is a great example of TDS.

    I’m no Trump fan, but TDS is real.

  42. Thomas Knapp

    Trump Derangement Syndrome is very real and comes in two forms:

    Trump Derangement Syndrome (T-Positive Variant), which causes those afflicted by it to believe that Jesus sent Trump to save MURKA, that Trump is simultaneously the heroic presidential strong-man MURKA needs and a mewling, helpless pawn of Deep State opponents who thwart his every move, and that when Trump says he’s going to do X, it means he’s doing X, even if he doesn’t do X.

    Trump Derangement Syndrome (T-Negative Variant), which causes those afflicted by it to believe that Vladimir Putin recruited Trump for the KGB and then rigged the 2016 election to put him (as opposed to Russian mole Hillary Clinton, who did Putin’s bidding as Secretary of State in return for lavish bribes) in the White House where he could serve the Russian state by e.g. having American troops killing Russian troops in Syria, funding and arming hostile Ukrainian and Baltic regimes on Russia’s border, etc.

    People un-afflicted by either variant of Trump Derangement Syndrome realize that Trump is business as usual — a little worse than the last president, just as every president is a little worse than the last president — but more theatrically inclined.

  43. dL Post author

    Trump Derangement Syndrome (T-Negative Variant)

    Wouldn’t that be Putin Derangement syndrome? After all, Trump is just one of the many Putin stooges at play. For example, Glenn Greenwald, Julian Assange, Roger Waters, etc, etc

  44. Chuck Moulton

    No recent U.S. Supreme Court justice has been libertarian across the board. I agree with some of the other commenters that Justice Thomas has been the most libertarian justice this generation on federalism issues, which in my personal opinion are the most important cases the Supreme Court decides.

  45. dL Post author

    No recent U.S. Supreme Court justice has been libertarian across the board. I agree with some of the other commenters that Justice Thomas has been the most libertarian justice this generation on federalism issues, which in my personal opinion are the most important cases the Supreme Court decides.

    Well, the thing about Clarence Thomas, it’s a good thing the government at the time of his nomination didn’t practice Thomas’ own position on the 4th amendment, otherwise he never would have made it to the Supreme Court. They would have rifled through his video rental history and that would have been the end of that.

  46. Thomas Knapp

    “Wouldn’t that be Putin Derangement syndrome? After all, Trump is just one of the many Putin stooges at play. For example, Glenn Greenwald, Julian Assange, Roger Waters, etc, etc”

    With a few possible exceptions, no one would give a rough fuck about Putin if Trump hadn’t won the election. President Clinton would be praised to the roof for her well-honed diplomatic skills when she emerged from private meetings with him to announce that they had reached an “understanding” on Crimea and were “working together” in Syria — by the same people who think Trump is Putin’s Manchurian Candidate.

  47. dL Post author

    Yes, Scalia was always better than Thomas on the 4th amendment.

    Thomas has a very narrow property-right scope for the 4th amendment: has the government interfered with a property right interest. Well, that might have been alright in the 18th century, but in the 21st century–where you have basically zero property right claims on where the great majority of your personal data is stored–that more or less translates to zero expectation of privacy from government rifling. You’re radically revising the rules of the game well past the point of no return( a la cloud computing, the internet of things, etc)

  48. dL Post author

    With a few possible exceptions, no one would give a rough fuck about Putin if Trump hadn’t won the election.

    Not with those wikileaks dumps. Instead of Putin being the impetus for impeaching Trump, Putin would have become the fall guy for insulating Clinton from the 24/7 Fox News impeachment drama(DNC election rigging). Same Putin stooges would be afoot with CDS.

  49. Bondurant

    Two democrats on the ballot for mayor of Phoenix. Had to draw my own write-in arrow to cast a vote for Baba Booey.

  50. Think About It

    Tapper asked Amash about a possible challenge to Trump in 2020 on the Libertarian Party line. Amash said he hasn’t ruled it out.
    Amash told “State of the Union” host Jake Tapper
    “That’s not on my radar right now, but I think it is important that we have someone in there who’s representing a vision for America that is different from what these two parties are presenting.”

    “Everything has become, do you like President Trump or do you not like President Trump?” continued Amash. “We need to return to basic American principles… and try to move forward together rather than fighting each other all of the time.”

  51. NewFederalist

    I commented hours ago that I would rather see Rep. Amash remain in Congress that to become the LP presidential nominee. I believe he can do more good in the House than being the voice of reason in a likely crowded presidential field. I wonder why my comment did not post?

  52. paulie

    Technical glitch. And the talk about Amash running is because he is likely to be redistricted out of likelihood of remaining in congress anyway.

  53. Florida Man Larry

    It looks like the Libertarian Party of Florida is planning to spend up to $1500 for “Libertarians for Trump” founder Walter Block to speak at their state convention in May. Self-described AnCap Walter Block is currently suing the New York Times for allegedly omitting context when quoting him about slavery.

  54. paulie

    Yes, they seem to have a very alt reich flavor to their speaker list. Woods, Deist and so on. And I noticed Brandi Hicks is the secretary of the state party.

  55. NewFederalist

    paulie- after your comment about Justin Amash potentially being redistricted out of Congress I read several newspaper articles from Michigan newspapers. While it appears to be he is being treated like a second class Republican by members of his own party, it doesn’t appear to me that his district will be redrawn with a Democratic majority. True, any re-election campaign will be more difficult but certainly not impossible. I still would rather he remain in Congress than become yet another GOP cast off nominee for the LP. Just my $0.02 worth.

  56. paulie

    Michigan is likely to lose a congressional seat so the speculation is that they will use that to basically district Amash out. i think the Democrats would rather see him running as a LP candidate for president than be yet another Republican congressman. I doubt he will run LP unless he already pretty much knows his congressional seat is going away regardless.

  57. NewFederalist

    I sure hope you are wrong. I would LOVE to see him as the LP nominee but NOT at the expense of having a libertarian friendly Representative continuing to serve in Congress. Most Republicans in the House are assholes IMHO and there are only a handful that aren’t. Amash is certainly one of those. I believe there are far fewer Democrats in the House who aren’t assholes. Perhaps none… if one comes to mind please educate me.

  58. paulie

    They are all better on some issues and worse on others. I’m not sure how closely that tracks to being an asshole. I’ve met lots of assholes in the LP and freedom movement who were great on issues but assholes nevertheless.

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