I recently received an email from Ted Brown, former Libertarian candidate for California’s 26th district, and current secretary of the Foothills region of the Libertarian Party of Los Angeles County. The email lists six announced Libertarian candidates for Congress, the State Senate, and the State Assembly. These are:
Dr. Randall Weissbuch, for CA-26, currently represented by David Dreier.
William “Bill” Cushing, for CA-29, currently represented by Adam Schiff.
Robert Bates for Senate district 22, currently represented by Gil Cedillo.
Steve Myers for Assembly district 43, currently vacant.
Eytan Kollin for Assembly district 44, currently represented by Anthony Portantino.
Dan Fernandes for Assembly district 59, currently represented by Anthony Adams.
I’m publishing a report in a few days or in several weeks about the 25 WORST Libertarian candidatss currently seeking office in California.
I’d like to offer any balance reporting availablel.
Anyone know of any one decent candidate running?
I’d like 25 to balance out the 25 worst, but at this point I would like to say the CA LP has one candidate on the ballot for something, anything, who is neither an outright crookor one of the complete dipshits who keeps putting their names on the ballot for ego purposes.
Please, helpful suggestions only, and I know where I am asking so I know full well what kind of response to get.
NO ONE who ever held title in ANY Libertarian committe should comment, because we want intelligent infeed ONLY.
IS there any intelligent CA LP left?
NOT ONE person mentioned above has even one IOTA of press recogntition ANYWHERE.
We want real people, people who have some intelligence, people who actually have done something which can inspire actual human beings.
We DO NOT want people who stand SAY they stand for something we want people who actually, once in their lives, actually stood for something
My own personal bet is there IS NOT ONE
and my report is ready to go on that
NOT ONE of the twits listed above even register ANYWHERE on ANY scale of how you reach voters
You sound like you’re on meth. Sheesh.
Josh, I must admit, that as a former Libertarian here in California, the candidates are generally uninspiring and lack the skills necessary for being an effective candidate. Very rarely does California get a Libertarian candidate worth voting for. James Gray is a notable exception.
Doesn’t CalLP have a few elected already? Are they running again, seeking higher office? Once elected, isn’t the point being to seek higher office based on one’s elected resume?
As a Californian myself (not a Libertarian, can’t stand the LP), I can attest to the fact that the LP presence here is just as extremist as the two major parties. Randall Weissbuch is apparently in my hometown and current district. I will give him a closer look if anything surfaces but I don’t expect any success from him. Dreier will be safe.
Btw, @7: The CalLP has no elected partisan offices, but a handful of notable nonpartisan officials like the aforementioned Jim Gray and Norm Westwell of Oceanview.
There are more, but those two are the most notable to me.
Consolidated list of Elected Libertarians
http://www.lp.org/candidates/elected-officials
It is not immediately obvious, but the list is in alphabetical order, by state.
Bruce Cohen?
Christina Tobin, running in the Libertarian primary for California Secretary of State, is an excellent candidate. She clearly knows more about election law than the likely Republican candidate for Secretary of State, who is a former football star and someone who had never voted in his life until he voted in a local special election in May 2009. Christina founded Free and Equal and has been active defending candidates in Illinois from having their petitions invalidated.
Allah Akhbar!
Of course it does not include Bruce Cohen.
Since he is a filthy jew who is on the side of the crusaders and zionists against the land of Islam, our Al Qaida “anti-war” (Anti-America) comrades on the libertaryan party of al qaida in california execution committee have administered the final solution on him! Allah be praised!
Really, what was it he did that was soo bad?
Christina Tobin is arguably the most impressive candidate for California Secretary of State since 1986.
None of the preceding comments were by me.
IPR has decided not to cover the expulsion, unlike the Angela Keaton matter.
Since I am an IPR Editor, I won’t be the first to post an article about the situation.
What did Bruce do that was so bad?
Well, he does not kneel to Mecca five times a day.
He is a jew, and the son of a jew.
He supports zionism and the American crusaders in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Unlike many of us in the Islamic world, he does not think it is OK for grown men to have sex with young boys.
Therefore, we decapitated him!
Let this be a lesson to all infidels!
Glory to Allah! Death to America! Death to israel!
Bruce,
IPR has not “decided” anything. There may very well be an article forthcoming.
Keaton’s expulsion was off the national committee, so it was a bigger story – but yours is a legitimate story as well.
Personally, I was holding off because
1) I don’t want to stir the whole pot about the other person who was expelled and give it additional publicity
2) I was not able to get any response from LPCA exec comm members I tried to contact about it so as to have their side of the story (as well as confirmation of the facts).
I just now, as I have been composing this comment, received your copy of the list of charges against you.
Give me a little time to read it through and try one more time to get a hold of a few people.
There will probably be a story about it here, and there’s a good chance it will happen today.
Here is what Bruce just sent me
Paulie,
I swear under penalty of perjury this is an accurate and
complete copy of the email Zander Collier sent to me
listing the charges against me that lead to my expulsion.
Thank you,
Bruce Cohen
Mr. Cohen:
I have inquired with the Chair of the Judicial Committee, Mark Hinkle, and he agreed that it would be acceptable to disclose the reason for cause, but not the case for cause. That is to be handled by the Judicial Committee should you request an appeal.
Reason for Cause:
Ongoing pattern of pernicious and toxic behavior, resulting in sabotage to the success of the Libertarian Party of California, while an officer and member. Particular offenses include but are not limited to:
– Conduct unbefitting an officer of the Party
– Harassment of members out of the Party
– Opening the party to lawsuits by engaging in sexual harassment of multiple female members and volunteers
– While serving in a leadership role, repeated personal endorsement of non-party candidates
– Operating campaigns of sabotage against other Libertarians
– Recording of auto-dial campaign messages for non-Libertarian candidates that the LPOC refused to endorse
– Character assassination
– Threatening to air private party disagreements and/or business as “dirty laundry”
– Airing private party disagreements and/or “dirty laundry”
– Public mischaracterization of political views of party members
– Sending of anonymous threatening emails so as to provide yourself plausible deniability.
There are others that have been itemized and documented but they refer to particular individuals and those individuals will again, be allowed to testify without threat of intimidation, harassment, or lawsuits. I trust the reason for cause is clear to you now.
Regards,
-Zander Collier
Southern Vice Chair, Libertarian Party of California, 2007-2011
Oh if only deform /reform types
Frank MacKay, John Dennis Coffey,
John Blare, John Bambey, and Valli
Sharpe Giesler were California Libs!
There are others that have been itemized and documented but they refer to particular individuals and those individuals will again, be allowed to testify without threat of intimidation, harassment, or lawsuits.
-Zander Collier
Southern Vice Chair, Libertarian Party of California, 2007-2011
-Don Lake, no, no, no you can not shield any one from civil suits, but any one in politics has very little battlement due to [thank good ness] the federal first (free speach) amendment and similar state provovisions …………
Anti-war, anti-jew, anti-america, anti-freedom // Jan 8, 2010 at 1:40 pm
“What did Bruce [Cohen] do that was so bad?
Well, he does not kneel to Mecca five times a day.
He is a jew, and the son of a jew.
He supports zionism and the American crusaders in Iraq and Afghanistan. ”
Don Lake: Well does he, as an American political officer, consider [like John Coffey, John Blare, John Bambey, Frank MacKay, and Valli Sharpe Geisler] the concerns of Israel WAY about the needs of the USA ?????
Now you know why I hate California. ~_~
Absolute and pure BS.
Ricard,
I”ll look into the Secretary of State race, but it’s my experience that the LP of Calif runs such candidates for ballot access reasons, the candidates actually do nothing.
I’m not a fan of that shit, especially when it IS NOT NECESSARY to maintain ballot status.
I know there are problems with the foregoing statement but I’ll let it stand.
Frankly, it HURTS us all when the LP of Calif puts such TWITS on the ballot
And, btw, I love it when Libertarians talk about the First Amendment as though they actually know something about it, have done anything in defeinding it, etc.
What jokes; just like when they “run” for office.
Mr. Cohen might be of a certain religious persuasion. I could bleepin care less, and that the LP of California obviously has a problem with that religious persuasion is another reason I want to keep my distance from them.
I have absolutely no clue who Mr. Cohen is, and no clue as to the current dispute, but since the LP of California obviously has a problem with him I’d like to send him a belated XMAS card.
Loot at the twit running in the 3rd congressional district of California, my home district.
That complete NUTCASE says that he wouldn’t sign for another person to get on the ballot unless he likes them.
Now, I don’t know what Libertarian experience he might have, but I consider that much more important an issue than discussion of what Mr. Cohen might have said, and might not have said on some discussion list.
I’m still waiting for that list of 25 respectable Libertarians.
Need I ask?
Hell no, I’ll just ask. Show me the list of 25 in the nation!
Everyone who matters already knows that the LP of California typically has used the Secretary of State race a battle fought in order to maintain ballot status.
I fully concur with that.
I just wish some of our candidates actually met a voter here and there.
IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK!
And i MUST challenge the previous LP re (is she?) as to her understanding of somehitng as important as the First Amendment/
What, in your tiny mind, leads you to think it has anything to do with private discussion?
It does not have anything to do with that. It isn’t written that way, and sometime you ought to read itl
If Bruce Cohen has been “expelled” from the Libertarian Party, I can virtually guarantee you, that he would be welcomed with open arms by the Republican Liberty Caucus.
Bruce, if you’re listening, there’s not one but two national organizations for Libertarian political activists. You do have an alternative. And if the LP doesn’t want you, I’m almost certain that Dave Nalle, RLC Chair would be esctatic to have you involved.
rlc.org
Gene Trosper // Jan 8, 2010:
“Josh, I must admit, that as a former Libertarian here in California, the candidates are generally uninspiring and lack the skills necessary for being an effective candidate. Very rarely does California get a Libertarian candidate worth voting for. James Gray is a notable exception.”
Lake: How is this happening ????? Like the ignored rape victim whom now has legions of eye witnesses verifying my original complaints.
I have run against the legendary Libertarian ‘Empty Chair’ and have talked to ‘good loyal Libs’ who were just being faithful party members.
Hey, it is not illegal, but the folks that keep quiet while I take the hit on ____________ [choose your issue] and then admit later that were mum only because they were avoiding the discomfort of being made fun by ‘people’ whom they do not know and will never meet!
Once again, I have mentioned stuff, gotten flack, and now [California and Sandy Ego County Lib dysfunction] tons (literally) of people whom know the truth step forward.
“I just wish some of our candidates actually met a voter here and there. IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK!” Lake: Appearly it is on the West Coast! While the behavior is not illegal and possibly not immoral, in Southern California it [Libertarian empty chair – itis] is legendary!
#23, (quote) “Mr. Cohen might be of a certain religious persuasion. I could bleepin care less, and that the LP of California obviously has a problem with that religious persuasion is another reason I want to keep my distance from them.”
On what are you basing this assumption of anti-semitism on the part of the CA LP? There’s NOTHING in Zander’s message to indicate there is any religious reason for it, not even any “between the lines” indications, and there are other Jewish members of the CA LP.
Please substantiate this or retract it. If the CA LP is indeed guilty of documented instances of anti-semitism, I need to know. Otherwise, your aspersions cast upon my state party are unwelcome and offensive.
I think the quality of discussion here would be greatly improved if IPR read back someone’s drafted comment to them before they were allowed to post. Perhaps being able to hear just how idiotic most of these posts are would encourage people to keep their mouths shut and only be thought fools.
I would suggest everyone not jump on their assumptions before finding out the facts of the case. I would especially counsel candidates for office to STAY OUT OF THIS and let it resolve itself.
I don’t know Bruce personally, and I am not party to any of the charges against him. So neither can I condemn nor defend him in this. I’m waiting to hear all the facts before deciding either way, and I suggest you folks all do likewise.
It’s important not to let things like apparently unfounded cries of anti-semitism against the CA party cloud people’s ability to consider the actual charges and their merits, if any.
Your cries that this has to be anti-semitism because Bruce has charges against him and he happens to be Jewish smacks strongly of people saying we didn’t vote for Obama because he’s Black, which makes Libertarians racist. I don’t know about you, but I had A LOT of reasons not to vote for Obama, and his race didn’t even enter into it. So just as you’d not have that game played against you, don’t play that game yourselves.
It’s important not to let things like apparently unfounded cries of anti-semitism against the CA party cloud people’s ability to consider the actual charges and their merits, if any.
Hi Carolyn, I don’t think any of us are in any position to judge the merits of the charges, since no one, apparently including Bruce himself, outside the CA LP EC has been presented with these merits.
If anyone would like to give me additional information about the case other than what has been posted in the comments here, feel free to give me a call at 415-690-6352, or write contact.ipr@gmail.com
Exactly, Paulie. Thanks for agreeing with me. As I said, the best thing to do is reserve judgment until more information is forthcoming.
As candidate recruitment chairman for the Libertarian Party of California, I am writing to defend our announced candidates for the 2010 election. Besides the six candidates mentioned @1, we have a total of almost 100 candidates who have signed up around the state. This includes all the statewide offices, 37 of the 53 congressional races, 10 of the 20 state senate races, and 39 of the 80 state assembly races. Many have run before, but many more have signed up for the first time. We had a lot of volunteers who contacted the party’s office this year, likely due to anger over current governmental policies — at both the federal and state level. Hopefully all of our candidates will succeed in qualifying for the ballot, since they need to go out and collect signatures from registered Libertarians to do so. There have been comments about our candidates’ qualifications for these offices. That is a legitimate concern for offices like Governor, Attorney General and Insurance Commissioner, but not really for congressional and state legislative positions. As has been proven on a daily basis, any boob can be elected (and has been elected) to those offices. In fact, the Libertarian group is probably better educated, more intelligent, and more successful in their professional careers than a large chunk of the incumbents in those offices.
Mr. Brown,
Thanks for making a very valid point.
I’m curious about the difference in the number of candidates listed in the body of the post and the number in your comment.
Is there some step(s) that those particular candidates mentioned in the body of the post have taken that the others you mention in your comment have not?
@comment 29, this would not help much. Most of us who write what are often thought to be incoherent or offensive comments, do so for a very specific reason.
Such as being used by your moms as a ball for basketball practice while you were a baby?
@34 Paulie, the breakdown is 7 statewide constitutional officers (Governor, Lt. Governor, Secretary of State, Attorney General, Controller, Treasurer & Insurance Commissioner), 4 seats on the State Board of Equalization, U. S. Senator, 37 Congress, 10 State Senate, 39 State Assembly, for a grand total of 98.
Ted
Some time ago the LP nationally, and in Californiaq, became a group more interested in
saying they were running a large numer of races,
and they did not care who they put forward because the LP doesn’t exist to do anything.
The numbers you cite have nothing to do with quality and no campaign is intended on the part of most of ’em. They file, then they do nothing.
Carolyn, I never used the term anti-semitism.
Maybe I could have told a Rabbi joke…I didn’t have a fresh one handy.
I will say that whatever the LP of California is doing is exactly what actual Libertarians need to be opposing…I have no specific sympathy for Mr Cohen, I don’t know the fellow and I don’t know the controversy. I simply know the LP of California, and if they oppose him I support him for the simple fact that they oppose him.
Look at the record of the LP. The record nationally and the record in California.
What if you threw a birthday party and no one came? That just happened. The LP national promoted the fact of its’ 38th birthday.
Someone elsewhere has noted that the LP national didn’t spend a dime on any race…I think that was in the last reporting period.
Mr. Brown has reported again exactly the kind of numbers which have been used over the last couple of decades to defraud donors.
They allege that the campaigns are real, but they don’t actually run. They file, then they do nothing. They’ve recruited candidates with phone calls. They call tthem up, tell ’em how easy it is to file, and they tell them that they aren’t expected to do anything.
Some guy gets off the phone and says “hey, honey, guess what? I’m running for congress.”
EVERY one of these people does harm to the cause of liberty.
The actual person, the real Libertarian who tries to get votes can’t, because the record is stacked against that person. The record PROVES that Libertarians cannot get votes.
See? Mr. Brown came right out and repeated the fraud. That’s the LP line, that’s what they do. NOTHING.
I pulled the number 25 out of thin air, out of my butt. No one has submitted a list of 25 WORKING campaigns. No one can produce that list. It doesn’t exist.
I could run a deal against the jerk in my own congressional disrict and probably I’ll do just that. That’ll be one of the few notable races the LP experiences.
Hollow victory? You bet. But one which nevertheless must be fought.
See, the guy in the third is THE REASON the LP gets nowhere. Ted counts him as one of the 100.
I don’t. He runs. Hell, i personally signed the guy’s sig in lieu…as I would for ANYONE, of ANY political persuasion.
I understand the critical nature of ballot access, of campaign finance, and what any Libertarian radical would say on that, well, once we knew what that meant.
Sometime just about the time some STUPID Libertarians said hey, let’s get us a bunch of people to file as candidates, well, on that day the Libertarian Party died.
It’s beyond STUPID. It is fraud.
Mr. Slevin, it’s utterly disingenuous to say that you never used the term anti-semitic. Your meaning was clear. But that’s okay, I’ll play. Let’s pretend you didn’t mean that the LPCA is anti-semitic, that you were referring to some OTHER “certain” religion of which Bruce may be a member, or maybe all religions. Doesn’t matter. There’s no record of the LP of CA ever censuring someone for his/her religious beliefs, so your accusation is false. Patently. False.
Since you say you are unfamiliar with the case, again, I would suggest refraining from forming opinions about it just yet. The action falls within the LPCA by-laws, a case is being made to support it just as (I trust) a case is being made to defend against it. The judicial committee will review the case and the excomm’s decision to suspend Bruce and then maybe you’ll be in a better position to form a reasoned opinion.
At this point, you, sir, are not privy to the case so you cannot by definition form anything resembling a fair opinion about it. You have said you don’t know Bruce Cohen. For all you know he could be the reincarnation of Jack the Ripper. Likewise, he could be a Medal of Honor recipient. You admit you don’t know, just as you don’t know any of the details of the charges against him, yet somehow you assume that the LPCA is wrong, no matter what it may or may not do in this case.
Beware of taking that sort of knee-jerk position. You never know who or what you may find yourself defending just because the LPCA took action against them.
Caroly,
It is knee-jerk. Long history has taught me that whatever the LP of California is up to must be opposed.
It long has been the pattern, practice, plan and policy of the LP of California to incite some of that party’s members to file for office. The resulting “campaigns” are a sham.
They then use the number of paper candidates as a bragging tool, to raise money.
It’s a scam. The people who run it are acamsters.
Carolyn,
I didn’t know Jack The Ripper.
I did once meet a Medal of Honor recipient and I responded in the main way I know…I put him on the ballot. He actually ran a campaign.
I’m sure that the ExComm of the California LP is drooling all over itself with the excitement of having someone to prosecute.
Imagine if there were an actual LP. Imagine the difference in our lives if there was an LP which focused on conducting actual campaigns rather than on petty infighting over who is the real Libertarian, how some obscure Platform plank is written, etc.
I agree and disagree..
We can’t only run campaigns we can win . we also need some paper candidates to get the brand out and let people know there are choices…
HOWEVER…
not just anyone should be allowed to run, you have to realize that as soon as some LP candidate does something stupid or says something outrageous , then here comes the press we desperately seek . lets not forget the dude who spit on the reporter in Cali , that kind of stuff reflects on us all so because we are all essentially representing eachother when we run , we need to be somewhat discerning.
What is Californias protocol for picking candidates??
In Nevada , we elect them to run at convention , so a potential candidate would have to have the majority of votes before he can run .Also , w/in the delegate pool , we have grouped together to form certain caucuses who decide who to support using more stringent criteria . The Vote for a Change Caucus of 06 in Nv had criteria that you had to come to extra candidate training and agree to restrict your speeches to what we coined ‘the green zone’ . The VFAC only voted for Vfac candidates at convention.
“I have absolutely no clue who Mr. Cohen is, and no clue as to the current dispute, but since the LP of California obviously has a problem with him I’d like to send him a belated XMAS card.”
me_ um he’s Jewish maybe a xmas card is not the best way to thank him. maybe a happy “washington crosses the potomic card” since it the same day and all.
I find something curious, I was told you knew who Bruce was? I am not going to say who you are on here if it is correct. I will just use your first intial of your name if it is correct. The letter D. If you really don’t know who he is, why would he say he knows you. I guess this is a big mess.
TLG @44
Libertarian Girl in 43 quotes someone else.
And after that she says “he’s Jewish”, because
we know each other and have had long interesting and funny talks about religion.
I’ll comment on Mister Slevin’s posting next.
LG that was the Delaware. “Washington’s crossing of the Delaware, occurring on December 25, 1776 during the American Revolutionary War, was the first move in a planned surprise attack organized by George Washington against the Hessian forces in Trenton, New Jersey.”
Thanks I needed that laugh this morning.
I put To Libertarian girl asking her a question. I am not libertarian girl myself. Did you get mixup about this? If you notice, the actual Libertarian Girl is in Blue and I am in black.
Mister Slevin gets it, kinda-sorta.
Wish I had more time to discuss here, but I have a meeting that’s a few hours drive away.
No, I’m not going to the San Berdoo LP County meeting to protest Matthew Barnes being their Vice Chair, either, it’s business.
__________________________
I’ll make three points about John Slevin’s assertions, agree with two and disagree with one.
Here’s where Mister Slevin is right:
#1 There IS a strong anti-semitic undercurrent within the LP and the LPCA in general. Not all Jewish Libertarians agree with me on this, but that’s my perceptions and I have many reasons for feeling this way. And can point to specific people and examples.
#2 The LPCA at this point certainly is a ‘do-nothing’ assembly. The smallest decision paralyzes them. They operate by ‘Crisis Management’ in a purely reactionary fashion.
They have no accomplishments to point to, and have a difficult time putting together a lunch for a dozen people catered by Subway.
Here’s where ‘Mister P’ is incorrect:
The LPCA’s behavior and motivation for expelling me is not related to the anti-semetism on the Board of directors. There are two people I consider anti-semitic on said Board.
One sort of a medium level, highly closeted anti-semite, and one that’s a very high level Jew hater who’s only semi-closeted.
If you search onlinecarefully or contact me privately, you can find out what current LPCA board member has a Nazi family past history and has worked with US White Supremacist groups at public events. Oh, as a Libertarian, and an LPCA officer.
How many people here have read the ‘Turner Diaries’?
I’ll be available only by phone for the rest of the day, and I know you all will miss my erudite and informative postings.
Libertarian Girl has my phone number if anyone needs me in an emergency.
I know Bruce , we do in fact have interesting conversations about religion .Hes my “ask a Jew” sounding board.
I tell him all about Mormonism and he teaches me about the Jewish religion. For instance I asked him if it was proper to give a Jew a xmas present because you like them and dont really feel any religious ties to the holiday of xmas , he told me it’s best not to.
He does translation for me , like last week when I had an email with “ferklempt” in it.
I do not hide , my name is Debra Dedmon , everyone knows it.
Michael , my bad ! glad u gotta laugh outa my stupidity , stick around , it wont be the last time:)
LibertarianGirl,
In California the LP has ballot status. Someone wishing to run can file on their own.
Conventions determine who receives the party nomination for statewide races.
Originally, the argument for paper candidates included the fact that the party would grow and thus there would be no more need for paper candidates except in those states where it is necessary to obtain and/or keep ballot status.
The problem is that paper candidacies have been not a means to an end but an end.
The national LP and the California Party tout candidacies which don’t exist except on paper.
They continue to tout these great numbers of candidates even in the face of huge declines in party membership and general stagnation in new registrations where voters are allowed to register Libertarian.
Anyone with half an imagination would want to see their state party and the national develop competence in actual campaigning, but it’s easier just to keep sending out those emails claiming great victories and issuing stands on various issues.
Most voters don’t trust the LP candidates with their vote because they see it as a wasted vote…and that is a common sense reaction to the fact that Libertarians don’t get votes.
Best way to get over that hurdle is to start asking people for their votes. That’s the difference between a real campaign and the kind “run” by most Libertarians.
I’m not sure if you were asking me if I know Mr. Cohen but as far as I can tell I don’t know him.
I cannot believe that Mr. Barnes would even consider or even be allowed to run for Vice Chair. This is very disturbing.
I agree.
My fave politcal quote for libertarians is
” if you know your philosophy is correct and your’e serious about changing the world , then you owe it to your philosophy to learn how to win elections”
Blackwell I believe
John Slevin and I have crossed paths before and we have our disagreements to say the least. But John is right to some extent.
The LP needs to get rid of this idea that we can run paper candidates. We have to set some standards and expect the candidates to actively campaign. That means raising some money. Campaigning door to door. Preparing a short statement for the media and appearing at community events and doing some basic preparation before even getting out of the starting blocks.
Brian Holtz has some basic tools on one of his sites and we need to make people aware of them and other sites like his then hope that we can put together a small how to presentation. Maybe we can talk nation into leading the way. Somehow. Someday.
oh I agree . When I say paper , I dont mean do nothing. I mean , doesnt stand a chance of winning. In NV you are expected to fill out all the paper requests , do all the media requests , show up to candidate forums , go door to door and table booths etc. If your not willing to do at least that you shouldnt be a candidate.
http://libertarian.meetup.com/441/members/
Mr. Barnes is on this
That’s sound thinking by LibertarianGirl.
And I don’t have too many quarrels with Mike Wilson!
I would advise you not to wait for National to be anything other than a money drain on those working for Liberty.
There never has been a majority on any LNC willing to do what the National party can and should do, which is to facilitate competent campaigns by Libertarians.
National and state parties should be assisting in some of the basic needs of candidates, such as voter list costs.
Successful campaigns are about Voter ID and GOTV—Get Out The Vote.
An effective campaign needs access to voter lists and since cost can be prohibitive for many of our candidates it is logical for this to be funded nationally and by state parties.
But its been 38 years and they haven’t got around to it yet; I’m guessing they never will.
I found John Slevin on the list of registered Libertarian voters and see that he lives in the 3rd Congressional District and 10th State Assembly District. In 2008, the Libertarian Assembly candidate in that district, Janice Bonser (who is a medical marijuana activist), won over 10,000 votes. The difference between the Dem and Rep was only about 500 votes, and the seat switched from Rep to Dem for the first time. So a Libertarian candidate can have a bit of influence that way. I have been recruiting Libertarian candidates in California for 22 years and have been quite successful at convincing people to run. I have run myself 14 times for various offices (but am taking 2010 off). I think it’s very important for voters to have an alternative in every election. And the way to keep the LP’s name in front of the public is to run candidates. Most people don’t pay any attention to politics except during the election season, so if we aren’t playing the game, we aren’t even noticed. We have had active candidates and we have had even more inactive candidates. These days it’s easier for even inactive candidates to get info out, with the internet. Sometimes it’s good to have a candidate on the ballot, since some scandal could erupt before the election and give our person an “in” to start campaigning. There have also been plenty of times when our candidate has been the only opposition to a major party candidate. In those races, our candidate has scored as high as 38% of the vote (and in that race was even at the polls but lost due to a massive absentee ballot effort by the Republican). When I recruit candidates, I call through the membership list until I find someone who is interested. I explain what is involved and then quiz the person about a number of issues. This time I only rejected two people due to their views. Most people don’t join the LP unless they have some inkling about what we stand for. On another note, some posters here are mixing this issue with Bruce Cohen’s suspension from the party. It’s worth noting that Mr. Cohen has been a great advocate for professionalizing our campaigns and for giving our candidates advice on how to do so. Additionally, there have been times when more than a third of the ExCom has consisted of Jewish-Americans (including myself), so I am quite skeptical of anti-Semitic claims. One can be at odds with one Jew and still be good friends with the Jewish race/religion.
LibertarianGirl // Jan 9, 2010:
“If you’re not willing to do at least that [media requests, candidate forums, tabling] you shouldn’t be a candidate.”
As much as Southern California Lib have been known, and I have actually attended forums where all the other candidates were seated, and have done my share [AOK, more than my share] of good natured griping on ‘Lib Stealth Candidates’ three things were ‘explained’ to me!
[a] ‘tain illegal
[b] ‘tain unethical
[c] it gets yet another Lib on the ballot were all the true voters get to see it on election season
[d] in San Diego County the two most important things are to get on said ballot and get your large size photo in the election preview of the hated but read Union Tribune. Everything else is eye wash
There is also Art Tuma in CD-3: http://arttuma.us/
“there have been times when more than a third of the ExCom has consisted of Jewish-Americans (including myself, Tom Brown), so I am quite skeptical of anti-Semitic claims. One can be at odds with one Jew and still be good friends with the Jewish race/religion.”
Lake: well there are Jewish Americans whom are good loyal patriotic Americans and then there are zealot zionist whom destroy truthful party organs, protect Israeli attacks on Americans, and protect Jewish espionage.
Two different tribes, two different tribes!
Never forget the USS Liberty!
Ted Brown,
I was one of those votes for Bonser.
The LP rarely is in the position of holding the balance of power in races and that defies logic.
If the LP was running effective campaigns we’d be holding the balance in most elections.
I have one more point and then I need to go do something more productive.
I have seen more than one Libertarian piss away their campaign funds. We claim to be “fiscally conservative”, which I think is a poor choice of phrases, yet when it comes to using what little funds we raise they often get spent wastefully. We don’t take the time to price products or services nor do we ask simple questions. “Is this the best way to do this?”
LibertarianGirl // Jan 9, 2010:
I tell him all [Bruce Cohen] about Mormonism and he teaches me about the Jewish religion.
I do not hide , my name is Debra Dedmon ,
Dear Lib Grrl: As you have opened the door to religion in secular public administration, could you please reply to two queries for my edification ??????
[a] among LDS, is there a stir about the Cody Qurik [a potential Lake/ Citizens For A Better Veterans Home ally whom as just ‘gone postal’ time and time again] and Ed Noonan multi year spat?
We supported Grundmann [big time] in 2004 [as non Constitutionalists] and were once [briefly] friendly with Captain Quirk.
Are we over reacting to these self appointed members of the ‘God Squad’ ???? They, like the Reform /Deform Party of California, were also victimized by the Establishment Duopoly of the California Secretary of State.
[How bad is the West Coast elections office ????? Massive staff turn over, including the top cheese —- like fascist GOP Reich Marshall Tom McMillin! One Dem or Republican forced from office!]
[b] How do Lib Jews feel about the non combatant USS Liberty, as attacked by Israeli ‘Defense’ Forces ??????? Dead and dying US sailors are a sympathetic focus, even connected to ‘allies’! Are we, the anti John Blare reaction and Citizens For A Better Veterans Home, over doing it ???????
Feel free to respond on thread, donlake@ymail.com or 619.420.0209 …….
#55, that’s San BERNARDINO. If you’re going to pretend to be the SBCLP, at least spell the name right.
Furthermore, Barnes may still be on their meetup page — I believe I am, as well, though I left the SBCLP in April — but as of Monday or Tuesday of last week, his membership in the state party (and by extension the county party) was suspended.
He has appealed. If the appeal fails, I’m sure they’ll get around to removing him. In any case, he has already resigned as vice chair.
My point is, don’t worry about it. It’s an internal matter for CA, just as Cohen’s suspension and appeal are internal matters for CA. And contrary to what Cohen has said, the LPCA has, in fact, been dealing with these issues in a timely and effective manner. Again, I encourage people not to rely on insinuations or assumptions but to wait for facts.
If Cohen is willing to cite specific and verifiable examples of anti-semitic behavior instead of his usual tactic of insinuations, then I would be interested in investigating it. I’m very sensitive to religious persecution within the LP and would like to be sure it’s stopped if indeed it’s occurring. Problem is, I need to KNOW it’s occurring, not guess, not surmise, not “have a feeling.” So things that look like attempts at character assassination and whiny drama queen martyr stuff don’t really work for me. I need facts, names, dates, events, contexts.
John P. Slevin // Jan 9, 2010:
‘The resulting “campaigns” are a sham. They then use the number of paper candidates as a bragging tool ………….’
Don Lake: Plz describe ‘sham’! As some one whom has run against the empty Libertarian chair at more than one candidates forum and then got creamed by said non candidate come election day:
it was explained to me, as if I had a room temperature IQ, that an L on the election season ballot was the most cost efficient advertisement available. This was inspite of complaints by other third party types whom (in Southern California) usually trailed the Libs ………
Carolyn Marbry // Jan 9, 2010:
………….. Barnes may still be on their meetup page ………..
Lake: that still does not compare with the dysfunctional John Blare ‘reformists’! Wonderful, yet flawed, former [2001 – 2003] state chair, now GOP, Jeff Rainforth; smart to quit days after being (reluctantly) elected [2004] state vice chair, ________; and my P2004 ballot access and then write in involvement in the Nader effort, all displayed as if they were still active [January 2010] in the West Coast political circus!
Mr. Cohen, as I’ve pointed out on another thread, has an annoying tendency to rant out his ass. His self-aggrandizing behaviors (for instance, self-describing as “erudite and informative”) and hints of paranoia (OTHER Jews may not, but he sure knows better) smack of classical narcissism. His comments on the effectiveness and moral character of the CALP, while having spent the better part of the last several years out of state, are so completely out of touch with reality that I might recommend having him committed, or at least bound and gagged.
If Mr. Cohen is so willing to air his dirty laundry in public, but will not give evidence for these defamatory accusations, I will recommend to California that they consider a libel suit on top of revoking his membership.
As to the effectiveness of the CA ExCom, or alleged lack thereof, I hear tell of a number of fundraiser dinners that were put on last year. Not only did people run active campaigns, but some actually succeeded in them, a rare thing for a Libertarian anywhere in the states. The current regime was able to save the party from insolvency within six months of their election – an insolvency brought about by the previous regimes heinous spending and accounting practices.
Perhaps Mr. Cohen is retaliating for the embarrassment he and his friends suffered for the discovery of their moral laxness?
As for indecision, well, they sure seem to have had no trouble kicking your insane ass out, did they Bruce? Along with the rest of the unsightly, dangerous, malignant, embarrassing garbage.
I recommend you shut up and act like a sane adult for a spell. You may decide you like it.
Don Lake,
by “sham” I was referring to filing and doing little or nothing
I was not out of the state for very long over the last two years, not more than one day, save a 41 day assignment in New Mexico.
I have nothing to be embarrassed about either.
Clearly this is more projection.
The poster can’t even use their name.
My statements are my opinions.
I stand by what I said and don’t mind being called names by an anonymous poster.
Rorschach,
Sometimes it’s good to keep in mind that libel suits are frowned upon by the LP.
See, this Cohen guy keeps confusing me. He managed to get ’em all pissed off at him, so he must be a good guy, ri9ht?
Then again, he was one of them and I can’t forget that aspect.
But he’s not one of ’em now, so I must choose to think he’s a good guy, I have no logical reason not to; even if from what I read he and I would have some real good arguments!
He sounds like someone who has been there and done it on organizing, someone with whom you share experience, and that is almost TOTALLY lacking in the LP.
Be good people, just be good!
Funny, Barnes says very similar things at times. Maybe you two can start a “too shitty for the LP” club.
Anyhow, it doesn’t change the fact that your “opinions” appear only to have basis in a magical fantasy land where you’re a good person.
Since you don’t mind being called names, I’ll keep it up. The faster we distance ourselves from your hysterical tantrums, sexual abuse, threats of violence, slanders and libels, the better.
A final note before I leave you all to stew in the filth it seems so many enjoy:
Just a moment ago Bruce identified with a group that mocks religion.
https://independentpoliticalreport.com/2010/01/michael-seebeck-running-for-libertarian-national-committee/comment-page-1/#comment-150191
Seems he’s only Jewish when it gets him attention.
And I respect Mr. Cohen’s use of his actual name when posting. This annonymous crap is flat-out wrong.
Rorschach,
What exactly is “too shitty for the LP”?
I mean, that’s REALLY shitty, right?
Or, do you know some alterant reality LP.
Which LP are you shilling for? National or CA?
What a ridiculous statement. Anonymity is a luxury afforded by the modern era as a recognition of the value of personal privacy. You have no right to any information about me, my name included. All that is provided here are the only things that matter in such a context. I’ll not have people judging the content of my posts by irrelevant details.
As it is, I am posting under this alias and only this alias. I have it on good authority that there are many, many individuals in the Party, including some officers, who are doing the same. All we seek to obfuscate are our identities.
Those who eschew anonymity have no right to complain when the Furies call them by name.
Mr. Slevin, I think that assuming Cohen is of good or evil character based solely on his association with the LP at this point or that is not very logical or reasonable.
After all, Barnes was also a member of the LP during that period; it doesn’t change the fact that he is a pedophile, nor does it make his pedophilia acceptable now that he’s been suspended by this party you claim to despise so thoroughly. Remember, even a broken clock is right twice a day. It’s too simplistic to paint every action by the LPCA as either good or evil and nothing in between. It takes a fair bit of effort to get to the bottom of what’s going on, I realize, but in the end, it’s worth it.
Posturing to make a point about how much you hate the CA LP without finding out the facts can lead you to support people and actions that you would consider reprehensible otherwise. That’s less than optimal.
@75
I shill for myself. I declare no loyalties to any County, State, or National organization. I speak my mind and damned be the consequences.
“What exactly is “too shitty for the LP”?
I mean, that’s REALLY shitty, right?”
Congratulations, you’ve made it to the point. I hope that this accomplishment brings some light and joy into your life, that one day, when someone finally stops long enough to drop a nickel into your cup and accidentally makes eye-contact, you can mutter incoherently at them something about “I understood something once”
Rorschach,
No. anonymity is the shelter if the balless.
Caroyn seeks to identify ME with the pedophile, but I have no truck with such slime, SHE DID.
It’s quite obvious that both this C character and this other idiot who doens’t publish a name and claims the right to being anonymous have a fundamental problem with the concept of personal responsibility.
EVERYONE knows who I am, I sign my name.
Cowards like you do not.
You will NOT find this Caroly shithead connected with any successful campaign anywhere.
I don’t know who this supposed female is, but she’s neve rdon eit, anywhere;…NO campaign, anywhere, PROVE ME WRONG
Not one campaign. This SHITHEAD is the kind of person who sits in REVIEW of others.
What human filth!
I’ve encountered this type before; I got right at em. This is a bitch
No talent, no achivement, NOTHING, except MOUTH annonymous mouth at that.
Excuse me? I did NOT identify you with Barnes. I said that if you choose to blanketly condemn anything the LPCA does, you may find yourself supporting someone or something you would otherwise find reprehensible.
It is I, sir, who have said to you on more than one occasion that you should quiet yourself and wait for the facts about these cases while you’ve continued to blather on about hating the LPCA so entirely that you can’t see anything good in any of their actions, apparently going so far as to believe Cohen must be a good person if the LPCA wants rid of him. They also want rid of Barnes. It’s not a huge leap to see that your stated logic also exonerates Barnes in your mind. If it is not so, then don’t make such ridiculous statements.
And do not presume to talk to me about personal responsibility. You have absolutely no basis for that accusation.
I have used my name on every single post I’ve made here. Every. Single. Post. You can verify that with Paulie if you want.
Ah, he’s lost all control now. Never mind. The conversation is over. I won.
Well, frankly, NO ONE could verify that with “Paulie” as you call him cause that ain’t his name.
People who cannot use their actual names are a problem.
ANd, there is no CASE.
Case presupposes govt. involvement, actual proceedinmgs in law.
I know you twisted types like to insinuate that you are courts of law, but you are not.
Hehe wait, what? This is the very coinage of your brain, that because Paulie’s not this person’s real name, he can’t possibly have access to the logs for this site on which he’s an editor, or find someone who does… ? With logic like that, who needs flat-earthers?
That’s what I get for trying to be reasonable with you. I guess I understand now that I’ve been having a battle of wits with the unarmed.
Slevin,
Now I know your name. I know it’s your name because you brag about it. Remember that.
If I were you and I had any sense, (which I understand would be breaking character, but bear with me)I would leave Carolyn out of your beef with me. I will tell you once – exactly once – that I don’t take kindly to people using that sort of language towards women at all, and especially not when they have done nothing to warrant wrath.
I’ve spoken with Carolyn myself online. She’s a good person, one of very few I have ever met. She is absolutely disgusted by Matthew Barnes and has made a point of seperating herself from that fiend. As far as I’ve been able to tell, she’s run a decent campaign, of a scope befitting an organization as puny as the Libertarian Party. She has been fair and open. She has been amenable to discussion and compromise. And she does not deserve your insults.
Clean up your fucking act, and for Christ’s sake, learn to fucking type.
John P. Slevin // Jan 9, 2010:
‘by “sham” I was referring to filing and doing little or nothing’
I can barely believe I am in the middle of this. As some one whom criticized the empty chair almost two decades ago I am now defending the practice.
Who made you the ballot protocol god ?????
What if you are wrong ????????
[Again, ‘tain illegal ……….]
Slevin: “… I don’t know who this supposed female is…”
Lucky for you, almost everyone on this list including this mysterious “Paulie” who cannot check the logs because that’s not his real name, has met this “supposed” female and can vouch for my existence, my name, my presence and yes, my involvement in the LP. They can’t vouch for the presence of my vagina, but trust me, it’s there. Otherwise my son would have had a devil of a time being conceived, much less born.
Slevin, do yourself a favor and quit while you’re behind.
Thanks for the words of support, Rorschach. (We’ve talked online? Okay, now I’m curious, but I’m okay with not knowing.)
John P. Slevin // Jan 9, 2010:
‘Rorschach, Sometimes it’s good to keep in mind that libel suits are frowned upon by the LP.’
Lake: Some times it’s good to keep in mind that suits of political types are destined to fail per the First Amendment and assorted ansulary considerations.
Libel is libel. If it’s provable, it’s prosecutable, even by a political party or by those directly and materially injured by it because libel is not protected expression. Period. You lie in print and cause demonstrable harm, you’re subject to a libel suit.
The difficulty is in proving the truth or falsehood of the statements and in proving the “materially injured” part, not in bringing the suit itself.
The thing is, even if the party brought a suit and it was dismissed, the cost of defending against such a suit would be prohibitive for most people.
Best to avoid it entirely, I’d say, and speak only the truth. But it’s just a suggestion.
Carolyn is of such good character, and expresses herself so well that I have sat back and let her do the talking, especially since she’s defending the Ca Ex Com and acknowledging that neither Cohen nor you, Mr. John P Slevin (I wish I didn’t know your name), know anything of what went on through the whole Barnes affair or what a difficult, energy-sapping project purging the man who was once our friend was. But for you to attack her, John P Slevin, and put ridiculous words in her mouth, is despicable. You’ve just undone anything of credibility you might have said previously.
My name, John P Slevin, is Jill Stone Pyeatt, and I’m proud to be on the Ca LP ExCom.
John Slevin. The standard notion of “wasted vote” is in no way “common sense.” It’s illogical.
Carolyn, magnificent example wo womhood I presume you to be,
Please allow me to reduce you a few pegs.
First, Paulie, who doesn’t use his actual name, defends you and can vouch for the fact that you exist?
ALL I did was ask for a list of 25 ACTUAL Libertarian campaigns in California.
I then generously UPPED my offer for a list of 25 in the whole damn nation.
And you hit me with this SHIT about who knows who on this SITE?
Pure B.S.
Some people have been there, done that.
You are not one of them or I would have known you, your assertions of your vaginahood notwithstanding.
Some people do things on the internet ONLY.
SUCH AS ON THIS SITE>
When you cannot operate on your NAME then yoiu don’t exist, not in my book.
I started this thread, look back.
I asked a simple question.
I asked for a confirmed list of 25 ACUALL working campaigns.
I’m still waiting for that list.
YOIU NEVER DID ONE THING TO GAIN BALLOT STATUS FOR THE LP IN CALIFORNIA. THAT FIGHT CAME MUCH BEFORE YOU!
ACTUAL pe0ple did that.
And it worked.
YOU WERE NOT ONE OF THEM.
What , his name isnt Paulie Cannoli?? liars every one of you liars!!:)
if he aint Paulie, dammit, I aint Melty!
Ok. Jill. You be proud.
You be proud to sit on a judicial body with
an “important” role.
You don’t do a thing except prosecute people
much better than yourself…but you go right ahead.
Your body and your title don’t exist but for
me and many others, excluding yourself, but you go right ahead.
I made it possible for you to be who you are…so, enjoy it girl!
I want you to have that. You live, you thrive by the kind of BYLAW nonsense which is the LP of California.
At the time the LP of California was formed (and it was one hell of a fight) there were certain decisions.
Obviously, one such decision was structure.
State requirements were such that we got what we got.
We got what we have.
What we have ain’t much.
I’m STILL waiting for my list of those 25 hardworking Libertarian candidates
No ExComm members need apply to answer this question,because to answer it is to invalidate their point in being.
See?
I actually deal in the electoral process.
What is it any current enrollee of the LP of California ExecOomm does?
Well, nothing.
they can’t because they ain’t, thankfully, a state body.
When seated, the twerps can do unlimited damage to our rights as citizens.
Feel safer my friends?
This is what the LP of California does.
This is the kind of shit they are up t0 and capable of
They lie, the cheat and they steal.
Feel safer now?
This guy Seebeck who announced for LNC might be what we need.
I read his shit.
I’d like to get one honest person on the LNC.
Just one is all it takes
Slevin is a troll. Carolyn, Jill, and Debra/LG are troll-feeders. Shame on all of them.
Anyone who wants to know what the LPCA is doing can just read http://www.calfreedom.net/.
Ted Brown // Jan 9, 2010 at 2:40 am
the breakdown is 7 statewide constitutional officers (Governor, Lt. Governor, Secretary of State, Attorney General, Controller, Treasurer & Insurance Commissioner), 4 seats on the State Board of Equalization, U. S. Senator, 37 Congress, 10 State Senate, 39 State Assembly, for a grand total of 98.
All well and good.
However, there is a discrepancy between that and the Post we are commenting on:
“Libertarian Candidates for Congress and State Legislature in California
I recently received an email from Ted Brown, former Libertarian candidate for California’s 26th district, and current secretary of the Foothills region of the Libertarian Party of Los Angeles County. The email lists six announced Libertarian candidates for Congress, the State Senate, and the State Assembly. These are:
Dr. Randall Weissbuch, for CA-26, currently represented by David Dreier.
William “Bill” Cushing, for CA-29, currently represented by Adam Schiff.
Robert Bates for Senate district 22, currently represented by Gil Cedillo.
Steve Myers for Assembly district 43, currently vacant.
Eytan Kollin for Assembly district 44, currently represented by Anthony Portantino.
Dan Fernandes for Assembly district 59, currently represented by Anthony Adams. ”
The part in bold is the actual post, and is probably read by more people than all the comments put together.
Obviously the part in italics says something different than the part in bold.
Did the candidates mentioned in the bold part do something beyond what the candidates in the italics part have done? Say, the first group took out their paperwork from the state and the second group has already returned it ahead of time?
Or is the post simply in error?
Slevin obviously is a troll.
You can get t0 this troll anytime of day.
Searchg him out.
The website is winlibety.com and Slevin IS there, by phone and by chat 24/7 (ssome of the people, true, are not me which ONLY is because I have but 2 hands and one mouth)
That site not even is live yet, but I thought I’d include it here to take care of my idiot detractors on this site.
I REPEAT, thive me the FUCKING LIST of 25 ACTUAL LIBERTARIANS STANDING FOR ELECTION,.
NOT ONE person commetning on this site (with the exception of the good and honorable Richard Winger) had anything to do with ballot access for the LP in that long ago year with the exception of me.
That is a fact.
When the California LP goit on the ballot, though some might object to my interpretation, laws were broken.
Point is simple, our party got on the ballot.
See?
undertand or go fuck off
@109 The six candidates mentioned in the original post are the candidates in just one small part of the state – the Foothills area of Los Angeles County. The poster must have received the e-mail announcing the upcoming meeting where those candidates will speak and ask registered Libertarians to sign their petitions. There are 98 announced candidates total throughout California. They have started their signature collecting period in an attempt to qualify for the ballot.
Brad, the email vaguely mentioned in the article above probably only lists the candidates who are eligible to get signatures from the Libertarians receiving the email. For a clearer picture of the LPCA’s emerging slate, see the recent article at http://CalFreedom.net.
Nearly 100 candidates are now at work getting signatures and/or gathering funds to put a Libertarian choice on the ballot in their districts. The ones who succeed will be giving voters a chance to vote for the only party in America that is neither left nor right, neither liberal nor conservative, and instead stands for a comprehensive and consistent vision of more personal and economic liberty.
If that’s not good enough for the boorish and spelling-impaired Mr. Slevin, he should lead by example instead of whining from the sidelines. And in setting an example, unsubstantiated claims of an unspecified amount of work on a registration drive 30 years ago don’t cut it. Wake me when he can claim a record of activism something like this.
Thank you, that explains it!
I also think your explanation further up makes a lot of sense…
“I think it’s very important for voters to have an alternative in every election. And the way to keep the LP’s name in front of the public is to run candidates. Most people don’t pay any attention to politics except during the election season, so if we aren’t playing the game, we aren’t even noticed. We have had active candidates and we have had even more inactive candidates. These days it’s easier for even inactive candidates to get info out, with the internet. Sometimes it’s good to have a candidate on the ballot, since some scandal could erupt before the election and give our person an “in” to start campaigning. There have also been plenty of times when our candidate has been the only opposition to a major party candidate…”
Candidates all help the cause in one way or another.
That’s quite impressive, Mr. Holtz.
I also really like your libertarianmajority.net/tools site.
Unfortunately it is buried within your site and not well known.
I think many affiliates around the country would benefit if the knowledge of the existence of this compiled information were well disseminated.
What do you think are some ways to get that knowledge in the hands of libertarians everywhere? It really should be more widely known.
As much as I’d like to see Libertarians sharing and leveraging the particular resources assembled in the LibertarianMajority Toolbox, I’d even more like to see a cultural shift among LP activists. We need to get out of the mode of extemporaneous opining, which just leads to reinventing the flat tire. Instead, we need to focus doggedly on 1) discovering and leveraging the state of the art in Libertarian outreach, and 2) advancing that state of the art so that activists and candidates who follow us will be working from a head start.
Otherwise, we’re just spinning our wheels.
Here’s a good rule of thumb: any purportedly meaningful contribution to a serious discussion of Libertarian outreach should probably include at least one URL, pointing to some state-of-the-art outreach resource or insight. Otherwise, what are the odds that the nugget of wisdom being imparted is so truly novel and original and non-trite that no Libertarian hasn’t already posted it somewhere — and more comprehensively and persuasively?
Brian,
Nice thoughts.
And I personally will commit to raising 1,000.00 for ANY real Libertarian campaign.
Before that happens, however, we must address the much more serious issue.
That is the sorry state of our campaigns.
The sorry state of our candidates.
I’ll do the $1,000.00 on this basis.
I’ll do it ONLY for a Libertarian candidate who has raised at least $20,000.00 independently of me.
I won’t spin my wheels.
I won’t do it for any Libertarian candidate who is running one of those races we all know they will lose.
So, I won’t do it for anyone running in a partisan race, period.
Find me that candidate.
I don’t think there is one in the whole damn country.
Prove me wrong.
Please.
When you find me that one person, that one Libertarian running an actual campaign, THAT alone is “worth the price of admission”.
Raising #1,000.00 for that person will be a pleasure.
It’ll take from one hour on up of my time to raise it, and it’ll be time well spent.
I’d still like to see a list of the 25.
Richard posted here earlier about Christina Tobin running for Secretary of State.
See, that dog doesn’t hunt.
They keep doing this SHIT.
You start at water board, park district, library, slme of those things…you ?”move up” from there
Find me that one person.
That is the Toolbox, get it?
It sure is funny how trolls talk to themselves!
You run for offices you can win or you do not run.
TRoll? I am just looking for that list of 25 ACTUAL Libertarian candidates.
tHAT IS WHAT I WANT.
“John P Slevin // Jan 8, 2010 at 1:02 am
I’ll do the $1,000.00 on this basis.
I’ll do it ONLY for a Libertarian candidate who has raised at least $20,000.00 independently of me.
I won’t do it for any Libertarian candidate who is running one of those races we all know they will lose.
So, I won’t do it for anyone running in a partisan race, period.
Find me that candidate.”
************************************
Norm Westwell
http://www.normwestwell4hbcc.com/
Ok Norm, I like what I saw. Allow me some time for due diligence.
Neither Ron Paul nor Dana Rohrabacher nor Jeff Flake ever won an election before Congress. Where is there evidence that this farm-team strategy can work for a third party, and is not simply cargo-cult political strategizing?
What I’m hearing from Slevin is: “As libertarians, we believe in the importance of spontaneous order arising among free agents pursuing their individual utility functions. Therefore, every libertarian who doesn’t pursue the strategy I centrally dictate to them is an idiot.”
Activist time and money is not a fungible commodity, to be redirected on the angry whims of people on the sidelines. Why should anyone take political strategy advice from someone who is obviously inept at influencing people who largely agree with him?
Mr. Holtz,
I’ m guessing here, really I am,
but maybe because not one of them ever was helped by you?
We all need to fall in line behind the dictates of the LP. Is that it?
MORON WITH A TRACK RECORD NOT MERELY OF LOSING-BUT LOSING SO HORRIBLY as to embarass us all.
I say, it doesn’t have to be that way.
Youre’ trying to do that right thing Holtz, and I commend you for that.
Quite simply, you DO NOT KNOW what the fuck you are doing.
It’s containted within the name, the “Libertarian Majority”.
Some of us have and will continue to oppose that very concept.
BW, the better clip from that film you could have used is the Latin Teacher bit.
Neither Dana nor Jeff Flake is an example of good people.
Period. I knew Dana, once, never met Jeff, and have no desire to meet him.
Do you? do you get it?
Resorting to calling someone a troll simply because they are passionate about their beliefs is unnecessary, but posting 20 different times in a row with sometimes as little as a four word sentence is also unnecessary.
John, I agree, the libertarian candidates here in California are weak. I also agree that almost any libertarian candidate in any state or federal race is weak as well. In my opinion it is a combination of unenthusiastic candidates, lack of money, lack of hard campaigning to build grassroots and netroots activitists, and lack of respect for third parties by the public.
Someday I would like to run myself. I’m very passionate about politics and follow IPR daily as I truly want to break the two party system. but I’ll have to wait until I am more financially secure. Personally, I want to take classes on public speaking. When I try, I consider myself a decent writer, and would love to work on my own speeches, honing my skills on getting out talking points, and converting people to our cause.
Unfortunetly, those things I would like in myself and other candidates are unrealistic at this time.
On another note, I disagree with your implication that they shouldn’t even be on the ballot. Quite frankly, I’m tired of voting in an election where I can only pick a Democratic or Republican puppet. Even if others claim that I am wasting my vote on someone who isn’t even campaigning, I would rather have my vote be counted as a protest vote so they KNOW of my dissatisfaction, rather then be yet another non-voter.
Personally, I believe the key is not trying to convert those who support Democrats or Republicans, but to convince those who do not vote to do so, and support a third party candidate. There are more non voters in America, and if we can get their asses up from the couch, perhaps this Republic can be saved.
I will always be a libertarian, but I would rather support someone from the Green Party then someone from system. And I would rather support a Libertarian who doesn’t campaign and is merely on the ballot then no one at all.
Besides, if we can find REALLY committed people, there is no reason why there couldn’t be a primary for those seats, so there is really no reason to complain so much about the list of candidates. At least there is a choice.
If you DO NOT UNDERSTAND HOW TO WIN ELECTIONS I SAY SIMPLY THIS>
GET THE FUCK OUT OF THE WAY!
Let’s those who do do!
My previous post was made to Mr. Holtz, it was not directed to Mr. Battenberg.
And there is NOTHING here at IPR for you to follow Mr. Battenberg, nothing you can learn.
Keep the go0d thoughts and go to it.
Someday I would like to run myself. I’m very passionate about politics and follow IPR daily as I truly want to break the two party system. but I’ll have to wait until I am more financially secure. Personally, I want to take classes on public speaking. When I try, I consider myself a decent writer, and would love to work on my own speeches, honing my skills on getting out talking points, and converting people to our cause.
Unfortunetly, those things I would like in myself and other candidates are unrealistic at this time.
On another note, I disagree with your implication that they shouldn’t even be on the ballot. Quite frankly, I’m tired of voting in an election where I can only pick a Democratic or Republican puppet. Even if others claim that I am wasting my vote on someone who isn’t even campaigning, I would rather have my vote be counted as a protest vote so they KNOW of my dissatisfaction, rather then be yet another non-voter.
Thank you.
We want a Libertarian choice in as many races as possible, even if they can’t be active candidates.
The more Libertarian choices on the ballot, the better.
If you can become a candidate – even a paper candidate – now, you would be doing the world good.
And, you may be better able to work your way up to more serious campaigns incrementally, rather than waiting until you can be the perfect candidate you might fantasize about being before running your first race.
The general pub lic doesn’t buy what you sell.
So, continue to try and sell it, by all means!
Sheesh!
Austin again repeats the point that Slevin can’t see through all the spittle on his screen: ceteris paribus, it’s better to have a Libertarian choice on the ballot then not. Slevin thinks that if he just curses loudly enough, 98 Libertarian ballot choices all across California can coalesce and transmogrify into one super-duper-candidate who can win a water board seat and thus begin an unstoppable march to the White House. Slevin asks for 25 serious LP candidates, but I ask him to name just 5 candidates of any smaller-government anti-rent-seeking party who have ever used the farm-team strategy to get to just the second rung on the electoral ladder.
I happen to agree that our better candidates — in terms of resume and resources — should focus on the least unwinnable races. But it’s simply addled to say that the LP should not take advantage of the scores of Libertarians who are willing to spend the time and money to get themselves on the ballot and thus let the electoral system measure just how many voters want more liberty.
Liberty in America won’t be gained on the votes of LP legislative majorities. It won’t even be gained on the swing votes of LP legislative minorities. It will be gained the same way it was lost: by incumbent politicians co-opting the positions of the candidates and parties that they see eroding their electoral margins.
But I’m not so politically obtuse as to think that every LP activist will agree with the strategy this insight naturally suggests. Nor am I so politically obtuse to think that the only good political strategy is a centrally-directed one like Slevin demands (and that he hallucinates the LP dictating). So I say, let a thousand activism flowers bloom, and let every activist pursue the forms of outreach that he finds most effective and satisfying. Just don’t waste too much of your time on inreach, trying to persuade other activists that their outreach utility function should replicate yours, and discouraging them from doing any outreach that doesn’t follow your divinely-revealed strategy.
Again: how obtuse does one have to be, to not see the irony in failing to sell your recommended political strategy to people who agree with your libertarian values, and then screaming impotently at them for their failure to win more votes from a public that largely doesn’t share those libertarian values?
The minimum standard for any Libertarian’s decorum should never fall below what a Kiwanis or Rotary Club would demand.
Mister Slevin’s language alone is deplorable.
Many people say I shoot my mouth off too much.
In light of that, I was keeping my head down on the matter, hoping someone else would be the ‘bad guy’.
Since I am personally to blame for all the ills of the California LP and kicking me out of the party is the only way they can succeed.
Basically because I’m mean to them in their eyes.
So I’ll be mean again here.
Mister Slevin’s language and behavior, especially towards Ms. Marbry.
Even though much of what he says makes sense to me, I can’t get past his impolite treatment of another human being like this.
Libertarians should treat other Libertarians politely at all times.
That’s MY eleventh commandment.
So Slevin, clean up your act, apologize in general and in specific and don’t do it again.
After that, you and I need to talk about the LP of California. ‘Cause I like a lot of what you say.
Slevin obviously opposes anything like a centrally directed strategy.
You are the person advocating that they go with the LP.
I’m the person advocating otherwise.
And I’m not about to clean up my act Cohen.
ESPECIALLY anyone on the LP of California deserves my venom, will get it, and better like it.
And Battenberg is right.
Cohen,
I won’t be polite to anyone on the LP of California specifically because they are criminals.
I wom”t sanction their behavior.
I know, for a time, you also were there.
Criminals don’t deserve my sanction.
You do not stand up to injustice by being polite to the very people who are unjust.
Y0u fight back. It’s messy, but that is what you do.
troll n. someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community
“Posting 20 different times in a row with sometimes as little as a four word sentence” is trolling. It has nothing to do with being passionate. It’s about trying to do with insults or repetition what you know you can’t do with reason. It’s about your R-complex writing polemical checks that your prefrontal cortex can’t cash.
So, get a namel
The general pub lic doesn’t buy what you sell.
On the contrary. The public IS buying what we are selling.
The voters that we do reach are largely avid supporters. The problem as I see it is that we lack the funding to reach all the voters.
Most LP candidates are largely better informed than most republican or democrat candidates running against an entrenched incumbent.
This is obvious if you bother to watch a debate. It has been told to me by several newspaper editors and reporters.
Your idea for the Libertarian Party to sit back and do nothing while the democrats and republicans tear our country apart is more than disappointing. It is irresponsible.
PEACE
Daily, the LP of California steals from people.
That’s what they do.
The organization long has existed to facilitate that act, the act of theft…
That is what they do.
I’m still waiting for my list of 25 real Libertarian campaigns.
Real campaigns have better things to do than humor trolls, Slevin. Fuck off.
If Slevin had an answer to the (obvious) point (made @57 @116 @117 @137 @140 @142 @151) that California voters should have the option of voting for more freedom, he’d have given it by now.
But he doesn’t have an answer. So he keeps trolling.
P.S. Every California voter gets a 100+ page voter guide. When a voter finds a Libertarian on her ballot and wants to read in the voter guide what the LP stands for, this is what she sees:
Libertarians are the only Party that won’t legislate your personal morality or economic equality. We are the only party free of the left-right gridlock of entrenched politicians.
Vote Libertarian for practical solutions based on principles of individual freedom, personal responsibility, voluntary cooperation, customer choice, and market incentives. Stand up for the Bill of Rights and limiting the federal government to its Constitutional role of protecting liberty and justice for all – on American soil. Vote Libertarian, and win a free country.
But Slevin doesn’t want quite so many voters to read this. He’d instead prefer that a Libertarian gets votes because they asked their butcher and barber to vote for the name they recognize.
Mr. Holtz, shame on you for feeding what you admit is a troll.
No. I’ll keep asking for that same list.
The Libertarian Party of California IS a scam, it’s officers are party to the fraud…
I mean, how much more plain can I be?
Brian, wh0 owns the ballot? Is it LP property or does it belong to the government, meaning all the people?
That’s who owns those ballot guides, that is not an LP accomplishment.
It’s a pretty lame argument to point to the publicly funded voter guides as the Libertarian Party’s great accomplishment. And plainly it cannot be since we don’t own the ballot, don’t own the guides.
There also is the obvious fact that winning campaigns don’t rely on mention in the guides.
Ed Clark once said “we exist to put ourselves out of business” and every Libertarian knew what he was talking about.
Now, the party of principle touts campaigns which don’t exist. The justification for some paper candidacies was that it was necessary due to ballot access restrictions.
It never was about building an eternal party.
And our party never has moved beyond that phase of paper candidacies? Why not?
Aside from the immorality of saying the campaigns are real when the majority of them never contact a single voter there’s another, logical reason to operate differently.
The current model never has worked.
The churn rate in new donors always has shown that the party membership model simply doesn’t work.
What if those campaigns were doing what all real campaigns do which is attempt to reach actual voters and ask them for their vote?
Good activist people burn-out in the LP; donors churn away, and still our national party and our state parties persist in this same dead-end mode.
It isn’t moral and it doesn’t work.
It is the antithesis of what the LP was formed to be.
Run real campaigns, that means all the hard work in contacting voters.
The only reason for the LP to exist is to facilitate the best campaigns of our candidates.
What we actually have is a national and state officer corps running their various fiefdoms.
The LP long ago became about a few people on an ego, control freak basis dominating a party which doesn’t run actual campaigns?
It simply isn’t moral and obviously it doesn’t work.
The LP National and State parties exist as creatures of the state. We are stuck with them because laws we know to be unjust saddle us with maintaining a certain structure if we are to work together in the electoral process.
The parties are an enemy of liberty.
It’s illogical for a Libertarian to trust our party…put up with it because we must, yeah…but never trust that state mandated structure we know to be corrupt. Keep it on as tight a leash as possible and give it no more authority than absolutely necessary.
It’s illogical for Libertarians to choose a top down structure. By keeping most resources local we ensure that control of the LP remains where by rights it needs to be, and that is in the hands of our members.
It’s entirely wonderful that Brian Holtz attempts to help empower our candidates.
I’m in complete agreement when Holtz acknowledges that we want our individual members to be creative and work how they choose, on what projects they choose.
That’s the best way to organize.
Obviously, Holtz works hard as do many others.
And the fact that Holtz, as one individual offers more tools to support our candidates than our National and State parties ever have put together is something every Libertarian could have predicted.
The mistake is in thinking we can have the one honest party. Can’t be done, the nature of the beast is that our party, any party by design is corrupt.
Our party’s many and well-documented financial shenanigans impede our common purpose, and that’s principally because parties ultimately give control and shelter to the most venal.
We know all that as Libertarians. So, we just need to get vigilant and never trust the party structure, never give it more than we must.
@140
You said, “And, you may be better able to work your way up to more serious campaigns incrementally, rather than waiting until you can be the perfect candidate you might fantasize about being before running your first race.”
While I generally agree, it definetly look a lot worse running for congress a 5th or 6th time, taking what you learned from previous campaigns, and hope you can win. The problem with that, is that the public will generally look upon you negatively as they approach the ballot box. ‘Oh, I’m not going to vote for this person, he runs every election cycle and doesnt even break 5%’.
I want to make sure I learn what I can, so I can run the strongest campaign I can the first time.
Also, to those who have been bashing Mr. Slevin, I would like to comment that while I do not like some of his negativity, or even the multiple posts, I still do not believe that he is trolling. I can read his posts and get an idea of his opinion and he is staying on topic. Just because you don’t agree with someone, doesn’t mean they are trolling.
I mean, a lot of times someone may post multiple times in a row because they are responding to different posts by different people, or trying to keep the discussion going.
In any case, I just recently moved back to my home state of California. It saddens me to see that so many libertarian activists are so unhappy with which the way the LP of California handles itself. Aside from elections, is there anything we can do to begin to unify?
By the way, I’m in the 4th district.
Austin, there are about 80,000 registered Libertarians in California. About half a dozen of them are complaining here on IPR about the LPCA. To find out about the activities and interests of the rest, read http://CalFreedom.net. In particular, see:
* http://www.calfreedom.net/search/label/InGovt
* http://www.calfreedom.net/search/label/InMedia
* http://www.calfreedom.net/search/label/InCourt
* http://www.calfreedom.net/search/label/Candidates
Slevin, it’s a mistake to assume that there is some big metaphysical distinction between the LP and its activists. The LP is whatever the efforts of its activists cause it to be. More important, much of what the LP is not but could be is because of Libertarians whose main form of “activism” is criticizing other Libertarians.
(Disclaimer: a nontrivial fraction of my activism consists in criticizing Libertarians for their excessive criticism of Libertarians, so readers can decide for themselves if I’m part of the problem or part of the solution.)
I suspect that the LP and LPCA would happily leverage more of the output of activists like me, if it weren’t for a vocal minority of Libertarians whose idea of activism is to tell other Libertarians what to do, and to viciously criticize them if they dare to do anything else.
Brian @163
http://www.fredtyg.freeservers.com/Eldorado.html
Well, I checked out CalFreedom. Though, to illustrate my dissapointment with outreach among the LP, I merely have to ask you to check out this link:
http://www.fredtyg.freeservers.com/Eldorado.html
I live in El Dorado County. Sorry, but I don’t exactly have the money, or ability to travel to SF or LA where some of the bigger LP chapters are. That link is the LP official page of El Dorado County. Should I just email the Chair? I don’t know, it just makes me not interested as it doesn’t even seem like they are trying to get people to join.
I myself am a registered Libertarian, yet I don’t have the money to become a dues paying member. The site almost hints as if you would have to pay $50 to be a registered Libertarian. Sorry, but I can’t even donate to the candidates I like, let alone the party I like that doesn’t even try very hard. 😛
Any suggestions?
“Austin Battenberg // Jan 12, 2010 at 8:13 pm
I live in El Dorado County. Sorry, but I don’t exactly have the money, or ability to travel to SF or LA where some of the bigger LP chapters are.
Any suggestions?”
**********************************
No problem!
Are you willing to spend maybe 8 hour per month to serve on a public Board or Commission?
If you live in an incorporated city, try your City’s web page to find these Commisions.
If you live in unincorporated county territory, check out
http://www.co.el-dorado.ca.us/bos/commissions/master.asp
I served on the San Jose Rent Commission from 2000-2004, so I am not asking you to do something I have not done.
Austin, I don’t see how you can say the LPEDC site “doesn’t even seem like they are trying to get people to join”. It says:
Yes, I’d email the Chair, and ask to have lunch. I’d also ask him or Rich Newell (our Northern Vice Chair) to register a county MeetUp and see how many other lurkers are nearby just waiting to get activated.
Critical mass can be quite small. In my previous county, San Mateo, a core group of just four regulars have been the nucleus of an organization that is quite effective for its size.
Austin_ I don’t know, it just makes me not interested as it doesn’t even seem like they are trying to get people to join…..
let alone the party I like that doesn’t even try very hard…
me_ im annoyed , who are you to judge that they arent trying very hard? maybe they are 1 or 2 people , maybe they have a day job , maybe they are waiting for others to stop pointing fingers , stop leveling excuses and to step up to the plate and help.
my psych take on your attitude is you know you should be doing something , you want to deep down , but you dont for whatever reason , and you feel guilty , so make it the County Chairs fault , cause the website sucks , yeah man thats why i cant muster pro-activeness , someone elses website sucks ….
be the change you want to see austin , and quit blaming others for your i difference
indifference
Hey, Debra, I’ll be nice to people interested in activating/energizing rural county affiliates in Nevada, if you be nice to similar California people. 🙂
Brian , ill try:)
Most Americans would like to see a Washington DC lifetime elite politician replaced by an average, ordinary, American. They tend to root for the underdog but the question is ‘will they support, work for and vote for an average American underdog?”
I can understand why some voters will consider casting their votes based on gender because and I agree it’s time to break the glass ceiling. Also, I can appreciate those who would vote their party’s ticket as long as the party truly represents their members. And finally, I appreciate those who believe in having someone in government who, by profession, is a patient advocate is desirable. But to all those people I say these are troubled times and we must set aside those preferences and vote for the one person who will best lead our county away from the financially destructive course it is on.
It’s time for the two major parties to step aside and let the voice of the people of our district be heard in Washington, DC. I am unique to the political scene. I am unique because I am so common. I am the average American who has been called to duty. I enter this arena as an obscure candidate not for glory or prestige. I enter this arena out of duty and fear for our country. I may come as the underdog, but I come highly qualified. I have served at the fringe of government. Though I’ve never held a public office, I have worked for the State of California’s Department of Health and was a member of Governor Brown’s Cost Watch team. I’m a financial powerhouse with a finance degree and a lifetime of financial successes. I’ve reported to the Boards of Directors, Presidents of Corporations, Senior Vice Presidents and held the position of Secretary/Treasure for a for-profit private healthcare company. I know how to go nose-to-nose with people in powerful positions and make my point.
My two major goals are: (1) to, for the first time in over a decade, take the voice of the people of our district to Washington DC by establishing an interactive communicative system that allows everyone to participate. The system I envision includes Citizen Oversight Committees to monitor my performance and behavior; and (2) to take our current dysfunctional governmental system and make it functional by establishing A.R.T., Accountability, Representation and Transparency at the candidate level. This includes a requirement that all candidates sign a legally binding “Code of Conduct” agreement with real and significant penalties before entering office. “A promise made is a promise kept.”
A vote for the incumbent is a vote for status quo and drives another nail into the coffin of middle class America. Whereas, every vote I receive sends a message to the Washington DC elite and enough votes will send a shock wave though the plush offices of the Washington DC elite and special interest groups.
Sincerely,
Darrell M. Stafford, http://www.uipusa.com
There is no Libertarian Party candidate running for my CA Assembly district nor for my State Senate district. Your emphasis on a national spotlight says to me that you are not concerned with districts that have no alternative candidates. Nor are you concerned with state laws as they effect the residents of these districts. Instead you have a candidate for governor, but no one to represent the voice of The People. It seems you want The People to be your voice instead of vice versa.
As a Libertarian Party candidate since 1984, I object to the comments that the LPC has not had a single credible candidate and that we file and do nothing.
I have always done as much as any ‘unlikely to win’ candidate can do without the funding of those ‘likely to win’.
In the 1980’s, that meant attending the few forums I was aware of that the incumbent either did not attend at all or spoke to the gathering by phone. That showed the confidence of the incumbent and the lack of support for even the other party’s candidate in a fore gone conclusion election.
In the 190’s, it meant learning to use the Internet to some extent and being interviewed – at long last – by some media.
For statewide elections, it meant traveling to as many local LP meetings as possible to raise some funds for the one sure TV interview all statewide candidates are assured by the CA Channel in Sacramento and the one radio interview in San Francisco.
Since the FPPC, it meant filing and re-filing due to mistakes financial reports even tho’ the amount of money was infinitesimal compared to the incumbent and the challengers.
As a Congressional candidate, it meant filing and re-filing FEC paperwork.
Now, more than ever, it means using the Internet, spending long hours at a keyboard responding to comments, writing Letters to the Editor, writing press releases, recording short videos or voice recordings in case someone asks for them, posting videos on line [so far I have not mastered that popular techniques but we do produce a public access program in our county that has been running for 9 years.
In all cases, it meant attending both the state and national LP conventions and begging for C-Span or radio time as a statewide candidate for the US Senate when the national LP was in CA and there was only one statewide election. Yes, I have not forgotten being ignored by my own.
Perhaps I am not young and pretty any longer or have not lowered myself to serve in some elective office in order to careen myself up the political ladder, I am not worthy of your attention.
Personally, I think every LP candidate deserves more that an also running and a short list of the party’s principles. If better coverage by the media were provided without the constant reminder that such ideas are those of fringe fanatics [see coverage of Ran Paul, for example], LP candidates might appeal to more voters. Telling voters they must choose the lessor of two evils or pick a winner is one reason they do just that, over and over again. Telling everyone that candidates other than the political parties in power lets the other one win, ensures voters will remain loyal to the DemReps.
Just because we are ignored and don’t have money or staff holding our hands as we campaign, does not make us less able, if elected, to Restore the Republic to its Libertarian roots.
Corrections to previous comment. I see I mistyped 1990’s as 190s, Rand Paul as Ran and forgot a comma or two. Sorry about that.
To: Independent Voter
The LP does the best it can with little or no resources. The number of candidates shows the determination of a small but committed group of individuals. Remember, as I was reminded by our local paper, the ‘other’ parties add up to less than 4% of the registered voters.
I found a number of LP SD and AD candidates on the LPC web site and my son is running for the district we live in now.
It is often easier to qualify for a Congressional election because others help you to gather signatures. Running statewide is the easist of all since many others help.
Of course, talking about the limits on the federal gov’t are easier for Libertarians. State Constitutions tend to be more empowering whereas the US Constitution follows Libertarian thought more precisely.
More candidates will follow when more voters and activists join the fight for freedom. The same holds true for other parties.
These are not excuses, just reality. Small but powerful in the end. Remember what the Socialist Party did without winning a single Presidential election. : )
As an LPC activist from 1980 to 1997, I fought against the top down and wanna be elected mentality of newer LP activists. I have to agree that the LP and the LPC have lost their proper focus.
As to the 25 candidates, wait for the General Election.
Meanwhile, I will do what I can to stir up all the candidates so they have an Internet presense to WOW even you.
: )
Liar! You personally missed numerous events and meeting after meeting and misused your potential allies day in and day out!
You personally, as a retired medical professional, pledged to visit a federal veterans hospital and or a state (CALVETS / CDVA) veterans care campus. You never did!
You missed event after event! You allowed myself and other abused veterans to travel all the way to the Goleta (Santa Barbara County) area for a non existent radio / television program. You never showed up, you never gave final directions, you never even answered your phone!
What a phoney you have always been! I appreciate what good you have done against the Establishment Duopoly,* but I am sure tired of trying to deal with Space Cadet / Steve Kubby style (so called) Libertarians, especially here on the Left Coast!
*especially in ballot access law suits, which rumor has that you were merely the hand maiden of secular saint ‘Frisco area’ Richard Winger. You may be ‘Junior Varsity’ on political realities, but in Winger, at least you have excellent company.
The truth, the truth, the truth, let’s all be in love with the truth! The truth is that you [like do little Chelene Ward Nightingale] are not what you say you are, and neither is LPCa!
Bruce Cohen // Jan 11, 2010:
“The minimum standard for any Libertarian’s decorum should never fall below what a Kiwanis or Rotary Club would demand ………..”
[Lake: you Israel First Zionist hypocrite! Look no farther than your teasing taunting and the absence of your ‘below minimum standard’ presence at Long Beach. ]
[Look no further than the reputation of your party and your self on the West Coast. Your cohorts have long realized that you are snide snarkie insincere and counter productive. An event with out Bruce Cohen is an opportunity to get some thing done!]
How do I. a non Lib living over a hundred miles (160 K) away know these things. Your reputation on the Left Coast is THAT BAD.
For you to give saintly advise while playing the devil is just so ‘California Libertarian’ ……….
California Libs as criminals ??????????/
Well, in a way ………. My *personal experience* has been that they are long on rhetoric and short on ethics. Criminal, that is a word I reserve for tax evaders like Leavenworth bound Donald J. Grundmann and court losers like Charlene Ward Nightingale ‘where’s the organization’s money’ ?????
West Coast Libs are *personal experiences* at least disingenuous and money hungry. They make a mistake, say not forwarding a copy of their news letter with your article contained, the first thing they do is hit YOU (not even registered Lib) up for life time member ship.
Gail Lightfoot [mid Coast], Edward Tesselier (sp) [Sandy Ego] and Richard Rider [Sandy Ego] are especially keen on this! Are West Coast Libs on straight commission ????????
California Libs as criminals ??????????? I would say *personal experience* that they approach the line on fraud and cross the line on every day ethics ………
Dear Doctor Donald J. Grundmann Junior, aka Brian Holtz: (modified quote, ” there are about 80,000 registered Libertarians in California. About half (modification) of them are complaining …….”
Lake: Like Grundmann, all your supporters are saints and all or you critics are devils ……… Your party has LOT OF CRITICS, MANY internally, and some of them write, email or talk to me!
Even people whom have jerked me around from two days to Sunday, Gail K. Lightfoot, RN, and Steve Kubby and Bruce Cohen. agree with me!
“IS there any intelligent CA LP left?” —- JPS
Jet Propulsion Slevin // [more ammo, via personal experience and or multiple references, at donlake@ymail.com and or 619.420.0209!]
“NOT ONE person mentioned above has even one IOTA of press recognition ………. ANYWHERE …….”
[and especially among other non Democans and non Republicrats, a potential recruiting pool. Every one has ‘rebound’ flow of once energized, enthusiastic activists or rank & file, but in LPs there is a motor on the revolving door(s)!]
“We want real people, people who have some intelligence, people who actually have done something which can inspire actual human beings.”
[and then you use them / abuse them and spit them out! One more time, LP Ca has SUCH a bad reputation among other non Dems and non GOP! Bruce Cohen and Brian Holtz are known from Oregon to TJ —— and not in a positive manner! Edward Tessiler (sp) and Richard Rider are legend on the southern border and not in a good way!]
3 John P Slevin // Jan 8, 2010:
” ……. personal bet is there IS NOT ONE
and my report is ready to go on that ………”
4 John P Slevin // Jan 8, 2010:
“NOT ONE of the twits listed above even register ANYWHERE on ANY scale of how you reach voters ………”
6 Gene Trosper // Jan 8, 2010:
” I must admit, that as a former Libertarian here in California, the candidates are generally uninspiring and lack the skills necessary for being an effective candidate. * Very rarely does California get a Libertarian candidate worth voting for. James Gray is a notable exception.”
* again, the wide philosophy of getting that “L” on the General Election ballot ……… Lake
[Lake: amen, brother, as far back as 2004, while I backed Looney Toons Doctor Grundmann on the local level, the state Reform Party backed Lib Grey. On the Left Coast he has Ron / Rand Paul like popularity among non Dems and non GOP! Met him personally. Unlike Nader, he comes off ‘well’!]
[well after every LPCa and national convention the phone rings off the hook, and not ‘happy happy’! Better keep the line open! Oh, JPS, give me a shout for more first hand horror stories!]