Mr? Mrs? Ms? v. Master Libertarian?

George Phillies in a Facebook post at Libertarian Radicals’ page recently noted, regarding the agenda for the next LNC meeting, that:

“The LNC is debating putting on the live meeting agenda for 15 minutes a motion saying that members who do not wish to be addressed as Mr or Mrs or whatever are entitled to be addressed in a reasonable alternative manner. The conflict with Roberts has been noted.”

Wes Wagner has replied with the following:

“Regarding the entire discussion about Mr. Ms. etc…

“I believe it is important to point out that these are the types of concerns that legislators and officials argue about when the empire is crumbling. The actual pressing concerns of the day seem unsolvable and unresolvable so they amuse themselves with tangential and irrelevant topics.

“You may notice that the same dramas that play out in the macro sense in our body politic at the US Government level are often echoed within our LNC. There is a reason for this, and that reason is that the LNC itself suffers from many of the same maladies.

“The reality is that systems once they have reached this state are typically beyond repair though graceful and incremental reformation, and reconstitution is typically required and a new foundation of thought and principle must be laid.

“We lived this reality in Oregon and came out on the other side of it stronger. Us, as members and stakeholders in the libertarian movement, need to come to terms with the notion that the LNC Inc. is a lost cause, and graceful reconstitution is the best method of maintaining the assets.

“If we allow collapse of a failing system to occur through its entire course, the assets typically are lost and destroyed in the process and we will be rebuilding from nothing. If we otherwise make a moral choice to short circuit the collapse of a failing empire, we can salvage as much value as is possible.

“We are faced with this situation on a macro level, and how we deal with it as individual on the micro level will determine whether we have the capacity and character to succeed in our primary objective.”

No word yet from Drs Liberman and Lark.

For what it’s worth this reporter, whose dad and daughter are each MDs (or about to be) and gets confused whenever anyone calls him Doctor Buchmaan, prefers the honorific “Professor.”

16 thoughts on “Mr? Mrs? Ms? v. Master Libertarian?

  1. Jill Pyeatt

    I suppose it’s conceivable that the LNC is accomplishing things secretly, but as per the LNCDiscussPublic list, it doesn’t appear this new LNC has done much in their first 6 months.

    Excellent commentary from Mr. Wagner, BTW–or should I call him Wes???

    As far as for me, as long as the name I’m called doesn’t start with a “B”, I’m sort of okay with it–

  2. paulie

    There are two “secret” lists that I know of, one is the strategy list which everyone except Starchild (I believe) is on. Nothing has been said on that list that I would personally think would damage the party if we made it public (and certainly no more damaging than this latest farce). I’m obligated to not say exactly what has been said on that list, but that’s my personal assessment.

    Nor do I think anything has been said on there that translates into any kind of immediate action to benefit us.

    There’s also a second “secret” list that I am not on, along with a minority of LNC. I don’t know what all has been said on that list, but as of the July meeting, Dan Wiener (who set that list up) told me it was low volume.

  3. Andy

    What a bunch of stupid, anal, bullshit for the LNC to waste its time on. Just call everyone by their first name and be done with it. This is a bunch of nonsense and anyone who thinks that this is a legitimate topic of discussion ought to be removed from the LNC.

  4. zapper

    Stop wasting time and resources.


    Stop wasting time on nonsense.

    For most of any meeting, you should be able to just meet, discuss and decide without mention of Roberts rules. If you can’t, your meeting and members are defective.

  5. Stewart Flood

    I also read it as 15 seconds of discussion. Of course that will be extended, which will require 2/3 vote, then a motion to amend, followed by a roll call vote.

    Fifteen minutes might actually be about right.

  6. Robert Capozzi

    I’d really like to hear how someone could POSSIBLY think this is a good idea. On its face, this sounds like something from THE ONION – bizarre, absurd!

  7. Larry Hutchison

    Now I know why nobody would vote for me when I submitted for the vacant position… I would not be thrilled about wasting the time/money necessary to perpetuate this insanity on the committee and/or the LP in general.

    Staying home in November feels like the smart play now – as maybe the insanity of the last LNC has transferred to this iteration and I am going to stay far, far away….. If I behaved like these folks, my employment would be at risk….

  8. Kevin Knedler

    Are you kidding me? This is a BUSINESS. A BUSINESS to help the states with their organizations and to get LP Candidates elected.
    Quit this nonesense. Get serious. It’s stuff like this that makes me ask if there is a correlation with the contribution levels being down.

  9. From Der Sidelines

    I thought Mr. Libertarian left when the LNC had its Root Canal?

    Apparently the Novocaine shot for that went straight to the collective brains, making them loopy to even have to engage in this nonsense.

  10. Marc Allan Feldman

    The LP in general and the LNC in particular strikes me like a dysfunctional family. But even dysfunctional families can find ways to get along and get things done.

    Seems to me most people fall into one of four categories:

    1. Libertarianists: Dedicated idealists concerned about whether one is a minarchist or an anarcho-capitalist, and how pure.

    2. Political Libertarians: Organizers and coordinators who want to raise the money, get the vote, and win elections.

    3. Small-government Republicans: Call themselves Conservatives and who are mostly for government non-intervention, except for issues like abortion and same-sex marriage.

    4. Free Radicals: Crazy, creative people who want to grow the Libertarian Party by making it more fun. For government non-intervention except for issues like abortion and same-sex marriage.

    I love all these people and they all have an important place in the LP. The question is how to get everyone to work together to move the LP forward.

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